Mercedes AMG F1 W09 EQ Power+

[PlatinumZealot]

It means that Ferrari are ensuring that it is legal before they commit resources to copy it!
Maybe expect Ferrari to be trying this trick in abudahbi testing.

[GrandAxe]

In short Redbull used it as a aero device and Merc is not using it as a aero device.

Well, thanks for answering... but i stay the same. What are the differences for being ilegal and the other being legal?

The Red Bull holes are on the wheel hub on the base of the spindle. Air travels through from inside the spindle out and shoots through the wheels rim. This set up is on the front wheel and when the wheels steer affects the downstream aero votrices.


The Mercedes holes are only on the back side of the wheel rim. The air travels from the cake tin - into a cavity between it and the wheel face then through the holes in the rim.
The Mercedes one slams the air into the backside of the spokes which thrashes the air around ...not veryThis aerodynamic is it? It not used for aerodynamics but for temperature management of the wheel. I belive it is heating than cooling.
Also this is on the rear wheel doesn't move under any controlled manner.

Exactly. Added to this is the fact that outwash from the rear wheels is basically a waste of air that could be put to use in the diffuser. Its almost certain that this is the kernel of the argument that Merc made to prove that their purpose is not aerodynamic.

Teams generally try to get air moving in precisely the opposite direction of an outwash - from the outside inward toward the diffuser where aero benefit can be gained. There is a huge history (across teams and over several years) of extensive effort to capture air energised by the rears and then direct that air inwards and downwards to the diffuser (never outwards); using slots, vanes, ridges etc in their floors, as well as vanes and other contraptions attached to their rear brake assemblies.

[Just_a_fan]

It means that Ferrari are ensuring that it is legal before they commit resources to copy it!
Maybe expect Ferrari to be trying this trick in abudahbi testing.

More likely trying to get it banned to help their cause this season.

Ferrari don't need it because they don't need to cool their rear tyres.

[PlatinumZealot]

It means that Ferrari are ensuring that it is legal before they commit resources to copy it!
Maybe expect Ferrari to be trying this trick in abudahbi testing.

More likely trying to get it banned to help their cause this season.

Ferrari don't need it because they don't need to cool their rear tyres.

My original theory is that the device is used for heating the tyres, much to the opposite of the common view that is is for cooling. Blistering events in recent races seems to support my theory too.

[pimpwerx]

It means that Ferrari are ensuring that it is legal before they commit resources to copy it!
Maybe expect Ferrari to be trying this trick in abudahbi testing.

More likely trying to get it banned to help their cause this season.

Ferrari don't need it because they don't need to cool their rear tyres.

My original theory is that the device is used for heating the tyres, much to the opposite of the common view that is is for cooling. Blistering events in recent races seems to support my theory too.

If blistering comes from the tire core being hotter than the surface, then it's a heatsink, meant to draw some of that excess heat out.

[PlatinumZealot]

My orignal explanation earlier in the thread is that the new heating device allows them to dial back the suspension settings to "colder" one to save the tyres.
It will blister of course if you go over the limit with the heating device.

Since i am open minded and not afraid to be wrong....
The only way it would be a cooling device if it it functions as an air diverter that funnels the air from the brake in the center of the wheel and away from the outer circumference where it used to be before. This would keep the hot air away from the barrel of the wheel.

However becuase the wheels is so conductive it is hard to say which effect is dominant without doing some sort of CFD analysis.

[e30ernest]

I think it's for heating the tires too. The brakes are so much hotter than the tires. If they're expelling brake cooling exhaust on the rim while also increasing rim surface area (through those grooves) then they're likely trying to transmit that heat into the rims.

Blistering is caused by overheating the surface of the tire while the core isn't up to temp isn't it? If that's the case then heating the tire via the rim makes more sense.

[Just_a_fan]

The brakes are applied for short periods of time but the rims are running in ambient air all of the time. The brakes have to be kept at a reasonably high temperature so that they work - the brake cooling is just enough to prevent the brakes overheating. The short blow of hot air from the brakes would be offset by the long blow of cool ambient air the rest of the time. Also, bear in mind that the rear brakes work much less these days as the rear braking is in part done by the energy recovery systems.

[bosyber]

It means that Ferrari are ensuring that it is legal before they commit resources to copy it!
Maybe expect Ferrari to be trying this trick in abudahbi testing.

More likely trying to get it banned to help their cause this season.

Ferrari don't need it because they don't need to cool their rear tyres.

It seems maybe it wasn't really declared legal, see my post in the Austin race thread just now

[Just_a_fan]

Yeah, as pointed out in the race thread, that tweet is totally without any evidence. The referenced website doesn't have a story on it although the Italian version does. Fake news until someone else shows evidence that it's true.

[turbof1]

Yeah, as pointed out in the race thread, that tweet is totally without any evidence. The referenced website doesn't have a story on it although the Italian version does. Fake news until someone else shows evidence that it's true.

I would rather call the source "questionable". Motorsport usually has a rather good reputation on reporting such things. That being said, it's very strange only the Italian version mentions this. I would not immediately dismiss it, but also not take it for granted either.

[WaikeCU]

I would say COTA this year is a doozy, because race day was entirely different conditions compared to Friday and Saturday, so I think teams had limited time to prepare a well thought race setup. So in that way, I think the W09 is probably more difficult to setup than the Ferrari. The Ferrari is probably per default a good car to drive.

[siskue2005]

I would say COTA this year is a doozy, because race day was entirely different conditions compared to Friday and Saturday, so I think teams had limited time to prepare a well thought race setup. So in that way, I think the W09 is probably more difficult to setup than the Ferrari. The Ferrari is probably per default a good car to drive.

also the overnight tyre pressure increase might have also contibuted

[dans79]

I posted this in the race thread, but it probably should go here!

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/13957 ... --hamilton

Mercedes changed the water pumps on both its cars ahead of the race after identifying problems after qualifying, when the component on Valtteri Bottas's W09 had a leak and data on Hamilton's car also indicated an issue.

He said: "You saw the car was in a million pieces [at the start of the day] so it wasn't ideal for the race.

"Probably if we hadn't had to have a morning like that, our race outcome would have been a bit different."

"But there was more on top of that, which we've just been talking about - and to how much of an extent that is," said Hamilton.

"In the race there was some debris, some damage on the floor, all these different things add up.

"A couple of tenths in floor damage, [but you] have to assume everyone else had the same thing.

"We had another problem that we just discovered but we don't know how much time that is."

Hamilton would not elaborate on that problem, but described it as an "outlier" that he struggled for pace and used his tyres aggressively.

"We were forced into a two-stop race for certain things we had that weren't ideal with the car," he said.

"We didn't know that was going to be the case when we got into the race.

"If we hadn't had the problem we've had, tyre usage wouldn't have been anywhere near as big an issue as we had."

Mercedes technical director James Allison suggested the team had suffered from the lack of dry running until Saturday morning.

"We normally get the car in a happier place than this, but with Friday being washed out we were blind to the problems we experienced today," he said.

"They were cruelly exposed today and they led to the disappointing outcome."

[turbof1]

Just so you guys know, it has been confirmed:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... i/3200594/

Seems they just did not wish to get a protest lodged against them, even though it has been declared legal.