Brazil GP 2008

[Rodzilla]

i have some timing information

Lap 69 Glock on grooved tyres, while ham and vett battle for 5th, vettel passes
trulli the only other driver on dry tyres

Glock S1 19.4, S2 40.9, S3 18.2 (1:18.688)
Vettel S1 20.1,S2 44.3, S3 18.7 (1:23.318) +15.2
Hamilton S1 20.2, S2 44.4, 19.8 (1:24.612) +0.7

Trulli S1 20.5, S2 43.0, 18.8 (1:22.428)

Lap 70

Glock S1 20.1, S2 46.0, S3 21.8 (1:28.041)
Vettel S1 21.3, S2 45.1, S3 18.7 (1:25.221) +12.3
Hamilton S1 21.3, S2 45.5, 18.6 (1:25.567) +0.7

Trulli S1 21.8, S2 49.6, S3 21.9 (1:33.539)

Lap 71

Vettel S1 21.8, S2 45.1, S3 19.0 (1:25.984)
Hamilton S1 21.6, S2 45.2, S3 19.3 (1:26.126) +0.8
Glock S1 24.8, S2 54.7, S3 25.0 (1:44.731) +5.4

Trulli S1 26.1, S2 55.7, S3 22.8 (1:44.800)


so in conclusion, the track became bad enough midway through lap 70, glock actually was much faster than trulli in the conditions

im a big massa fan but i believe glock was just struggling with his tyres and didnt back off on purpose, because trulli did exactly the same thing

even so, hamilton is really lucky to win this title if the rain came down 30 seconds later he wouldnt be king right now

excuse me because im going to have to go to hospital now for some heart checks

[JamesS]

He lost by one point last year and won by one point this year.

Justice has been done.

Well done Lewis, very well deserved.

Onto number 2 now!

[Miguel]

MAssa was great at making himself the defacto #1 driver title for himself this year, even after the early season mistakes, great mental toughness. Lewis clearly earned his number 1 spot this year early on, but Kovi improved over the year, hopefully his reliablity improves and he camn show all his potential.

I agree on the Massa camp, especially since the awful critics after his Spin at Sepang and his Spins at Silverstone. However, I feel otherwise about Heikki. I feel that his race pace has been atrocious this year, although some issues with tire degradation and brake conservation have made it look worse. I'm starting to think that his Montmeló accident has taken a toll. It's not very noticeable in qualifying pace, but it does seem like Heikki doesn't want to go that extra step when racing. The funny thing is I don't think it's a problem with lack of talent, and of course not equipment. The difference between Heikki and Lewis doesn't seem smaller to me than that between Nelson and Fernando.

[PlatinumZealot]

At least we now know one thing for sure after this race; Vettel is a better driver than Hammy.

Nonetheless, congratulations to Lewis and Macca. They deserved the title (they had the most points). Congrats also are extended to the team I fancy, Ferrari, for the team honors. I don't think anybody is to be blamed here, as Glock just did not have any grip. 7 points were a lot to overcome and it proved that it cannot happen twice in a row.
Now, how can we get Vettel into a Ferrari ASAP? I think if that happens, Bernie will have to tweak the points system so the winner gets 10 pts, the runnerup gets 12 and 3rd place gets 8 and so on down the line.

How do you figure that? the light rain b4 the start obviously comprimised HAmilton's strategy... He was fueled heavy but had to come in early for slicks, Vettle pitted a couple laps earlier and passed him. Hamilton obviously turned the engine down for the last half of the race. Also he was running much less wing which slowed him alot in the rain. Then Vettle caught up to him because he had fresher dry tires near the end becuz of Hamiltons comproimised strategy... and then lastly Hamilton was ahead when Kubica held him up... Vettle surely ran a great race, but it was no indication of who was the better driver. I doubt Vettle will even look that good next to Webber next year... but we will see.

I agree to the max! Vettel is great but his car was faster on that lap because of tyres.. Hamilton in his own words said he was loosing it and trying to keep it together, keep vettel from overtaking..

Everybody saw what happened... obviously Anybody could have passed Hamilton at that point!! Anyways i think Vettel is the next best thing for next year.. too bad he's gonna be in a Red Bull..

[Rodzilla]

At least we now know one thing for sure after this race; Vettel is a better driver than Hammy.

Nonetheless, congratulations to Lewis and Macca. They deserved the title (they had the most points). Congrats also are extended to the team I fancy, Ferrari, for the team honors. I don't think anybody is to be blamed here, as Glock just did not have any grip. 7 points were a lot to overcome and it proved that it cannot happen twice in a row.
Now, how can we get Vettel into a Ferrari ASAP? I think if that happens, Bernie will have to tweak the points system so the winner gets 10 pts, the runnerup gets 12 and 3rd place gets 8 and so on down the line.

How do you figure that? the light rain b4 the start obviously comprimised HAmilton's strategy... He was fueled heavy but had to come in early for slicks, Vettle pitted a couple laps earlier and passed him. Hamilton obviously turned the engine down for the last half of the race. Also he was running much less wing which slowed him alot in the rain. Then Vettle caught up to him because he had fresher dry tires near the end becuz of Hamiltons comproimised strategy... and then lastly Hamilton was ahead when Kubica held him up... Vettle surely ran a great race, but it was no indication of who was the better driver. I doubt Vettle will even look that good next to Webber next year... but we will see.

I agree to the max! Vettel is great but his car was faster on that lap because of tyres.. Hamilton in his own words said he was loosing it and trying to keep it together, keep vettel from overtaking..

Everybody saw what happened... obviously Anybody could have passed Hamilton at that point!! Anyways i think Vettel is the next best thing for next year.. too bad he's gonna be in a Red Bull..

they had the same tyres didnt they? hamilton simply isnt on vettel's level in those conditions, dont blame tyres

hamilton put himself in that position, basically cruising for 30 laps before the rain put him at risk and it almost cost him the title

and when i say almost, its the biggest almost of all time

btw i say webber will beat vettel overall, webber ends careers and is a bigger step up from racing against bourdais

[ISLAMATRON]

MAssa was great at making himself the defacto #1 driver title for himself this year, even after the early season mistakes, great mental toughness. Lewis clearly earned his number 1 spot this year early on, but Kovi improved over the year, hopefully his reliablity improves and he camn show all his potential.

I agree on the Massa camp, especially since the awful critics after his Spin at Sepang and his Spins at Silverstone. However, I feel otherwise about Heikki. I feel that his race pace has been atrocious this year, although some issues with tire degradation and brake conservation have made it look worse. I'm starting to think that his Montmeló accident has taken a toll. It's not very noticeable in qualifying pace, but it does seem like Heikki doesn't want to go that extra step when racing. The funny thing is I don't think it's a problem with lack of talent, and of course not equipment. The difference between Heikki and Lewis doesn't seem smaller to me than that between Nelson and Fernando.

Actually we agree, I think Heikki was good early on, was affected by the accident but then improved at the end of the season only to have reliabilty mask it... Heikki is bette than Nelson Jr but Lewis is better than all of them, Alonso included... Could you have ever imagined a rookie matching a 2XWDC? We havent seen anything like it since Senna went to McLaren and outshown Prost.

[Spencifer_Murphy]

they had the same tyres didnt they? hamilton simply isnt on vettel's level in those conditions, dont blame tyres

hamilton put himself in that position, basically cruising for 30 laps before the rain put him at risk and it almost cost him the title

and when i say almost, its the biggest almost of all time

btw i say webber will beat vettel overall, webber ends careers and is a bigger step up from racing against bourdais

Who cares if they were on the same tyres, Lewis had a lower downforce setup than most, and regardless of setup you cannot say performace is related only to tyres, perhaps the car plays a part?

Also to say Vettel is better in those conditions because he passed Lewis is basing the argument on one incident in isolation, on that basis Lewis is the best in torrential conditions for his performance in Silverstone...but wait so is Vettel for his race in Italy.

As I said before, to judge a drivers ability on one incident in isolation is to do an injustice to all of their vast talent.

EDIT: Also how can you critisise him for "cruising" for 30laps, he only needs to finish 5th, with a car running an engine on its second cycle. To push to hard would be stupid, like in Japan. I guess no matter what you can't please all the people all the time.

Finally, I agree that Webber might cause Vettel problems, in a phycological sence...but I've yet to see Webber end the carear of any driver that's really rated. (Cristian Klien and Antino Pizzonia are NOT in the same league as Vettel. Also with DC, Webber didn't end his carear, 15years in F1 driving for two of the biggest teams at the time, and a third - still good team - , winning 13 GP's being WDC runner up once and winning more points than anyother driver from your (frankly very successful) nation cannot be summerised by the performances of guys last year in the sport)

[ISLAMATRON]

they had the same tyres didnt they? hamilton simply isnt on vettel's level in those conditions, dont blame tyres

hamilton put himself in that position, basically cruising for 30 laps before the rain put him at risk and it almost cost him the title

and when i say almost, its the biggest almost of all time

btw i say webber will beat vettel overall, webber ends careers and is a bigger step up from racing against bourdais

Vettle caught up to HAmilton partly because hamilton had to run much longer on the last set of dries than Vettle, and partly becuz LH was saving the car and have position 5 in hand.

Remember they came in for inters nose to tail.

Vettle easily passed HAmilton becuz Kubika strangly held up HAmilton, and just as importantly becuz HAmilton had more of a dry set up than Vettle and "struggled" in the 2nd sector all race... meaning he had less wing.

We all know a wet setup in the dry losses much more time than a dry setup in the wet, tires notwithstanding. So the conservative comprimise was to set up HAmilton for the dry, which happened to be the majority of the running.

[PlatinumZealot]

Rodzilla Go to 2:40 and you'll see what i mean.. watch Kubica. remember kubica (Fernando's little friend) is a lap down!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oZrbRadt2I

[vyselegend]

Hum, n smikle, were you as unhappy when Hamilton had the same exact behavior toward race leader Fernado Alonso in Japan? Or were you among the ones arguing he was acting smartly to unlap himself in case half the grid would be kinapped by aliens in the last lap?..

[ISLAMATRON]

Hum, n smikle, were you as unhappy when Hamilton had the same exact behavior toward race leader Fernado Alonso in Japan? Or were you among the ones arguing he was acting smartly to unlap himself in case half the grid would be kinapped by aliens in the last lap?..

HAmilton was not the leader so Kubica would not have gained another lap of running simply by passing him, he would have had to work all the way to Massa to unlap himself, that would have been highly improbable.

Secondly Kubica had to pass Vettle to get to Hamilton so he should have known they were in a battle for position.

But in Kubica's defence even Vettle said he didnt know what position he was in, they were merely all trying to keep it on the track.

Kubica could have won this race had he started from the pit lane on Slicks and full of fuel, but that was his team's call not his. He didnt have much to look forward to anyway starting in 12th, should have gambled

[641/2]

Tragic. Hamilton only once was pressured in this race to drive for the title and as usual he B-L-E-W it. This was quite reminicsent of his unravelled drives last season when he turned into a dizzy schoolgirl at the faintest hint of a critical situation. The least Hamilton can do is buy Timo the most expensive Christmas present ever. Hamilton better savor every moment because this is his last drivers title. Hamilton has now demonstrated for two consecutive seasons that he is incapable of mastering his wits when the situation assumes a critical nature and victory hangs in the balance. Ironically, that is the single situation where one needs to execute their finest performance. That is the only situation that tests the mettle of the man. Anyone will improve their craft with time as will Lewis, but that is a world apart from possessing the mental strength and the mettle to completely harness ones faculties under conditions of great emtional and psychological stress. The qualities of a leader are not taught or learned. Someone is born either with or without those qualities. After all, didn't Damon Hill and Jacques Villeneuve win drivers titles? Lewis will have their cosy company in the sea of lavishly rewarded mediocrity in the years to come, especially if the grid tightens up with the 2009 regulations. I will completely change my mind when Lewis convincingly outdrives his opponents for a title in 2009.

[ISLAMATRON]

Tragic. Hamilton only once was pressured in this race to drive for the title and as usual he B-L-E-W it. This was quite reminicsent of his unravelled drives last season when he turned into a dizzy schoolgirl at the faintest hint of a critical situation. The least Hamilton can do is buy Timo the most expensive Christmas present ever. Hamilton better savor every moment because this is his last drivers title. Hamilton has now demonstrated for two consecutive seasons that he is incapable of mastering his wits when the situation assumes a critical nature and victory hangs in the balance. Ironically, that is the single situation where one needs to execute their finest performance. That is the only situation that tests the mettle of the man. Anyone will improve their craft with time as will Lewis, but that is a world apart from possessing the mental strength and the mettle to completely harness ones faculties under conditions of great emtional and psychological stress. The qualities of a leader are not taught or learned. Someone is born either with or without those qualities. After all, didn't Damon Hill and Jacques Villeneuve win drivers titles? Lewis will have their cosy company in the sea of lavishly rewarded mediocrity in the years to come, especially if the grid tightens up with the 2009 regulations. I will completely change my mind when Lewis convincingly outdrives his opponents for a title in 2009.

And how do you explain his dominence in China? Thatwasn't in crunch time was it? Hamilton was clearly hindered by the early race shower and the conservative strategy. If not for the brief early shower I actually think he would have won this race.

[Badmon]

Tragic. Hamilton only once was pressured in this race to drive for the title and as usual he B-L-E-W it. This was quite reminicsent of his unravelled drives last season when he turned into a dizzy schoolgirl at the faintest hint of a critical situation. The least Hamilton can do is buy Timo the most expensive Christmas present ever. Hamilton better savor every moment because this is his last drivers title. Hamilton has now demonstrated for two consecutive seasons that he is incapable of mastering his wits when the situation assumes a critical nature and victory hangs in the balance. Ironically, that is the single situation where one needs to execute their finest performance. That is the only situation that tests the mettle of the man. Anyone will improve their craft with time as will Lewis, but that is a world apart from possessing the mental strength and the mettle to completely harness ones faculties under conditions of great emtional and psychological stress. The qualities of a leader are not taught or learned. Someone is born either with or without those qualities. After all, didn't Damon Hill and Jacques Villeneuve win drivers titles? Lewis will have their cosy company in the sea of lavishly rewarded mediocrity in the years to come, especially if the grid tightens up with the 2009 regulations. I will completely change my mind when Lewis convincingly outdrives his opponents for a title in 2009.

And how do you explain his dominence in China? Thatwasn't in crunch time was it? Hamilton was clearly hindered by the early race shower and the conservative strategy. If not for the brief early shower I actually think he would have won this race.

Dont listen to that moron.. toyota gambled and lost bottom line. Hamilton was playing it safe this race period! Last minute showers thru a monkey wrench into the whole equation.

[Badmon]

Tragic. Hamilton only once was pressured in this race to drive for the title and as usual he B-L-E-W it. This was quite reminicsent of his unravelled drives last season when he turned into a dizzy schoolgirl at the faintest hint of a critical situation. The least Hamilton can do is buy Timo the most expensive Christmas present ever. Hamilton better savor every moment because this is his last drivers title. Hamilton has now demonstrated for two consecutive seasons that he is incapable of mastering his wits when the situation assumes a critical nature and victory hangs in the balance. Ironically, that is the single situation where one needs to execute their finest performance. That is the only situation that tests the mettle of the man. Anyone will improve their craft with time as will Lewis, but that is a world apart from possessing the mental strength and the mettle to completely harness ones faculties under conditions of great emtional and psychological stress. The qualities of a leader are not taught or learned. Someone is born either with or without those qualities. After all, didn't Damon Hill and Jacques Villeneuve win drivers titles? Lewis will have their cosy company in the sea of lavishly rewarded mediocrity in the years to come, especially if the grid tightens up with the 2009 regulations. I will completely change my mind when Lewis convincingly outdrives his opponents for a title in 2009.

And how do you explain his dominence in China? Thatwasn't in crunch time was it? Hamilton was clearly hindered by the early race shower and the conservative strategy. If not for the brief early shower I actually think he would have won this race.

Dont listen to that moron.. toyota gambled and lost bottom line. Hamilton was playing it safe this race period! Last minute showers thru a monkey wrench into the whole equation.