Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

[Scorpaguy]

It will be very interest

I've seen many episodes of NewScanCooking...yet to see anything I would eat, but have developed a bit of understanding of those folk's svelte frames. While the cocoa-fish dish may be real, I will bet that Ham will not be dining on it.

2020 WDC - Ham in a Merc
2020 WCC - Big Red
2021 - Ham in neither a Merc or Big Red...retired

[Phil]

I can easily see the logic in Ferrari hiring Hamilton, the most obvious one being: if the best driver who has beaten you 3 out of 3 times in the last seasons is in your team, he isnt driving against you.

You destabilize your biggest competitor by taking their star driver. That is worth a lot.

From Hamiltons perspective, i can see less of an attraction to go there, but if i needed to point out a few points in favor, well, for one the belief to achieve something no other has done since Schumacher and that the rules post 20 might put more control into the drivers with the new regulations and supposed “closer racing”. A damn good driver could make a bigger difference relatively speaking than with the current regs.

However, i could only see this unfold, if Mercedes flirts too heavily with Verstappen over a seat or/and if key personell would jump ship with Hamilton.

The likeliest scenario IMHO is Hamilton staying at Mercedes if Toto stays as well. If not, i wouldnt discount the possibility.

As for a potential team up with Leclerc, i dont see a big issue.

[Wass85]

Everybody wants a slice of the Mercedes pie by the sounds of it. I wish Mercedes would bin boring Bottas and give us some fireworks, Alonso or Verstappen please.

[NathanOlder]

Everybody wants a slice of the Mercedes pie by the sounds of it. I wish Mercedes would bin boring Bottas and give us some fireworks, Alonso or Verstappen please.

If Mercedes had Alonso or Verstappen next to Lewis in 2017 and 18, I dont think Mercedes would have won the WDC.

There's a perfect reason that Bottas is worth it.

[Wass85]

Everybody wants a slice of the Mercedes pie by the sounds of it. I wish Mercedes would bin boring Bottas and give us some fireworks, Alonso or Verstappen please.

If Mercedes had Alonso or Verstappen next to Lewis in 2017 and 18, I dont think Mercedes would have won the WDC.

There's a perfect reason that Bottas is worth it.

I'm not sure, they won the titles from 2014-2016 albeit with less competition.

[falonso81]

They had such a performance advantage in 2014-2016 that it allowed them to have intra-team battle.

[PlatinumZealot]

It will be very interest

I've seen many episodes of NewScanCooking...yet to see anything I would eat, but have developed a bit of understanding of those folk's svelte frames. While the cocoa-fish dish may be real, I will bet that Ham will not be dining on it.

2020 WDC - Ham in a Merc
2020 WCC - Big Red
2021 - Ham in neither a Merc or Big Red...retired

Mark Webber is that you?

While i would love for HAM to go to Ferrari in 2021 there is much more to gain instability by staying at Mercedes. The cars and rules will be new so he would want to keep other variables at a minimum.

[NathanOlder]

Everybody wants a slice of the Mercedes pie by the sounds of it. I wish Mercedes would bin boring Bottas and give us some fireworks, Alonso or Verstappen please.

If Mercedes had Alonso or Verstappen next to Lewis in 2017 and 18, I dont think Mercedes would have won the WDC.

There's a perfect reason that Bottas is worth it.

I'm not sure, they won the titles from 2014-2016 albeit with less competition.

The car was head and shoulders above the rest 14-16. In 17 and 18 the Ferrari was more than a match.

[Wass85]

If Mercedes had Alonso or Verstappen next to Lewis in 2017 and 18, I dont think Mercedes would have won the WDC.

There's a perfect reason that Bottas is worth it.

I'm not sure, they won the titles from 2014-2016 albeit with less competition.

The car was head and shoulders above the rest 14-16. In 17 and 18 the Ferrari was more than a match.

I still think they would comfortably win with two alpha dogs.

[Capharol]

I'm not sure, they won the titles from 2014-2016 albeit with less competition.

The car was head and shoulders above the rest 14-16. In 17 and 18 the Ferrari was more than a match.

I still think they would comfortably win with two alpha dogs.

like the 2016 Ham/Ros rivalry...... never ever, that would have cost them a shitloads of points and Ferrari would have been right up their ... behind.....

[Phil]

The 2016 rivalry proves that it did work, because Mercedes has a strong management in place that was/is willing to do what is necessary to restore order as best as possible. They didn't adhere to the wishes of their 'star driver', but did what they believed was in the best interest in the team: They controlled the strategy and gave limited options (strategically) to both drivers, hence focus on starts and qualifying, they swapped around team members, and when there was a crash I believe there were threats to "sit a driver out" at a next race.

Strong management. The team comes first.

Mercedes also have a very transparent environment where I strongly believe that both drivers (yes, Bottas too) has equal opportunity. When people make mistakes, they come forward. This creates a healthy environment.

[Capharol]

The 2016 rivalry proves that it did work, because Mercedes has a strong management in place that was/is willing to do what is necessary to restore order as best as possible. They didn't adhere to the wishes of their 'star driver', but did what they believed was in the best interest in the team: They controlled the strategy and gave limited options (strategically) to both drivers, hence focus on starts and qualifying, they swapped around team members, and when there was a crash I believe there were threats to "sit a driver out" at a next race.

Strong management. The team comes first.

Mercedes also have a very transparent environment where I strongly believe that both drivers (yes, Bottas too) has equal opportunity. When people make mistakes, they come forward. This creates a healthy environment.

it worked because they had a really dominant car....

but yeah the managment of Mercedes is very strong

[izzy]

The 2016 rivalry proves that it did work, because Mercedes has a strong management in place that was/is willing to do what is necessary to restore order as best as possible. They didn't adhere to the wishes of their 'star driver', but did what they believed was in the best interest in the team: They controlled the strategy and gave limited options (strategically) to both drivers, hence focus on starts and qualifying, they swapped around team members, and when there was a crash I believe there were threats to "sit a driver out" at a next race.

Strong management. The team comes first.

Mercedes also have a very transparent environment where I strongly believe that both drivers (yes, Bottas too) has equal opportunity. When people make mistakes, they come forward. This creates a healthy environment.

Mercedes' management of Rosberg was 100% pants. it just didn't matter 2014-16 because the car was completely dominant, but they had the tyre load data in Monaco 2014 and did nothing, let him win, saw him deliberately take out the other car in Spa and gave a feeble fine, had that awful atmosphere in the team all that time and 2016 Spain (both cars out) and Austria, with Lewis threatening to leave, and then afterwards admitted it was Rosberg who'd been 'vicious'! It was just typical F1 team bottling the issues with their drivers, same as Ferrari and Red Bull and Force India and all the others. plus they had Niki doing stupid jokes on TV about Lewis trashing his hotel room, blaming him for Spain and for turning up his engine in Bahrain without mentioning it was Rosberg who started it

It's great now because of the drivers, both being fair people so the team doesn't have to do anything except not be unfair. It's super easy now, because Lewis is faster and just naturally wins and is a real sporting person and so is Valtteri. if it got difficult there's no history of Toto being able to manage it any better than Mattia or Otmar or whoever. This is why the second driver is such a tricky one, and imo why Valtteri is gold. Tho even so Toto managed to innocently cock it up with the "wingman" thing that still hasn't quite gone away

[Phil]

Dominant or not, the only liberty Mercedes had, was to give both drivers a better shot at winning the race by going with an alternative strategy. Example: Bahrain 2014, when Rosberg did O-P-O and Hamilton was on a O-O-P strategy.

Of course, if the race is closer, a team may be forced to use the driver in 2nd to play a role in securing the win for the other driver. But even in 2017 when the race was relatively close with arguably a edge to Ferrari (they were leading the championship after all), they still gave Bottas every opportunity and Hamilton was asked to give back a place. This is what strong, transparent and fair management is about.

I have no doubt that whoever takes that seat next to Hamilton, that the rules will be absolutely clear and that at all cost, the team comes first. Because the drivers are hired by the teams and not the other way around. And if there is friction, then I am sure that strong management will step in and get both drivers to play nicely (as nicely as Rosberg and Hamilton had to, which arguably they did). Considering the competitive nature of both Rosberg and Hamilton, it's to Mercedes credit that there were so few incidents, Spa 2014 and Barcelona 2016 coming to mind. Sure, there were some other incidents like Hockenheim 2016 (or was it Austria?), but I am sure those were dealt with internally.


I'd add to say, this the transparency at Mercedes is one of the reasons why Hamilton is still there and has a good relationship with Toto, despite what happened in 2016 and what Hamiltons feelings are towards them swapping the teams. That IMO says a lot.

[izzy]

Dominant or not, the only liberty Mercedes had, was to give both drivers a better shot at winning the race by going with an alternative strategy. Example: Bahrain 2014, when Rosberg did O-P-O and Hamilton was on a O-O-P strategy.
I'd add to say, this the transparency at Mercedes is one of the reasons why Hamilton is still there and has a good relationship with Toto, despite what happened in 2016 and what Hamiltons feelings are towards them swapping the teams. That IMO says a lot.

yes Mercedes are generally fair with their strategies, apart from Sochi 2018, and yes Lewis and Toto have a great relationship, quite rightly afaic as they are both great people, but they had to have a clear the air talk in one of their kitchens at the end of 2016 didn't they, and that was because of how the team hadn't managed Rosberg

Of course the Board might have been interfering who knows, but anyway that period wasn't a great example of driver management i don't think. Great driver management would've just kicked Rosberg out after Monaco 2014 for that pre-planned cheat on his teammate. Lewis has always forgiven other drivers' low points, like Fernando in Hungary and Jenson in Turkey, or Seb in Mexico, but not Rosberg, because he knew it was a long term strategy to win dishonestly, and the team must've known that too but they took the easy way out, until in the end he ratted them out too

so, on topic, F1 drivers are generally too difficult for teams to 'manage' how everyone expects and the way to do it is picking the drivers, more than managing afterwards. They're the most wilful and paranoid people going, and pairs that naturally coexist are the way to do it, and that's been Mercedes' secret, since 2017