[ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
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ispano6
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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MAX VERSTAPPEN Q&A

How are you feeling after last weekend?

I feel good but of course the result was not what we wanted, which was to score a good amount of points and fight for the win. I was looking good for a podium which I thought was easily possible because it was basically between Mercedes and myself on raw pace. But then you also look at how the whole race panned out, we could have scored a good amount of points against Lewis but it is what it is, we can’t change it and now I’m looking forward to hopefully having a more positive weekend. We were a bit down on pace compared to Mercedes in qualifying so we definitely need to close that gap to fight them in that area rather than on strategy. Our pace is usually a bit better in the race than in quali but there is still quite a bit of work to do which the engineers are flat out on. We have ideas and the direction to work on for this weekend so that’s positive.

What are you doing to keep busy between races?

The environment is really beautiful here so that’s nice and I’ve been on a few runs with my trainer in the local area. I relaxed a little on Monday and then met up with the engineers and we talked through some ideas for the weekend. We also had a Team BBQ last night which was a good way to have some fun in our Team bubble as we cannot go anywhere outside of that. The days go by quite quickly.

What’s different heading into this weekend compared with last weekend?

I’m looking forward to racing on the same track again this weekend and it’s a good opportunity to get a better understanding of the car. Whatever we found wasn’t perfect last weekend we can improve this week. On the same track I always think it’s quite nice to do a direct comparison, depending on the weather, and hopefully we can do better this time. It looks like it could rain this week and I’m not sure anybody knows how competitive they are in the wet with these new cars so that could be interesting. I always enjoy driving in the wet, I don’t mind it, but to be quick you need both the car and driver to be 100%.

ALEX ALBON Q&A

How are you feeling after last weekend?

I feel ok. In some ways I tried to switch off my thoughts after Sunday’s race and take the positives from the weekend. The car is in a good window, we’ve still got a bit of work to do but we’re there and we can fight – that’s the main thing. The biggest shame is we didn’t capitalise on the race and we didn’t get the points we deserved, but I’m going into the weekend confident. I feel like there are areas to improve on in myself and as a Team, but I’m feeling good and ticking down the days to Friday. There will be a slightly different atmosphere this weekend because we know the track and the car, nothing has really changed from the last race, so it will just be about fine tuning things and working on the areas in the car Max and I have been talking about.

What are you doing to keep busy between races?

I went hiking on Monday which was good fun as you don’t really get chance to hike the mountains in the UK and then we went to the lake. Yesterday, I went on a bike ride, and then we had a BBQ with the Team which was good fun. I might play some golf today so it’s been a very chilled out week, but I’m making the most of the Austrian countryside.

What’s different heading into this weekend compared with last weekend?

I think there’s less anticipation heading into this weekend now we’re in a rhythm. We know where the car is at, driving and set-up wise, we know what’s needed, so there are less unknowns and now it’s just time to do the business. Get into the weekend, fine tune things and close the gap to Mercedes.
https://motorsport.nextgen-auto.com/en/ ... 49847.html

Jaisonas
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... spielberg/
Red Bull sees opportunities against Mercedes: Aero problem slowed the start - AMuS

Translation DeepL:
Mercedes has set the bar at the season opener. Red Bull was impressed, but not shocked. The challenger knows where you lost half a second in qualifying. If the aero problem is solved, much of the gap could be made up.

On paper, it looks dramatic. Mercedes drove in its own league at the season opener of Formula 1. 0.538 seconds ahead of Red Bull is one word. Especially on a track as short as the Red Bull Ring. The shock at the challenger was only brief. In the meantime, you think you know why the gap was so striking. The problem can be solved. The only question is how fast. First changes will already be made at the second race in Spielberg.

Red Bull has lost three tenths in corners 7 to 9. These are the three fastest corners at the Red Bull Ring. Actually the playing field for Red Bull. Analysis has shown that some aerodynamic components have twisted too much under the high lateral acceleration. For example the underbody. That caused a stall. The drivers lost confidence in their car. "This also caused Max to spin during practice," reports sports director Helmut Marko. To make the car more predictable in the fast corners, Red Bull increased downforce. "This cost us even more time on the straights."

Honda still too conservative

But Marko also takes Honda to task. "Mercedes has undoubtedly made a great move with the engine. They have a lot of power in qualifying mode. Honda is still too conservative with the engine settings. Our approach is a different one. We would rather have one more engine in the season and be able to attack for it. If you can get the penalty on the right track, the damage isn't great."

It's not yet clear which front wing Red Bull will use in the second race. In terms of lap time, there's not much difference. "It's in the characteristics of the wing and the interaction with the underbody. That was also the reason why Alexander Albon got going so late. He lost the thread a bit when he changed the front wing. It was agreed in advance that Max would get it if there was only one copy. When Albon had to change to the old wing, it didn't really fit together with the underbody at the beginning. And it was still a little rusty. The longer it took, the better he got going."

Marko thinks the RB16 has good genes. That's what the race has shown. "There our aerodynamic problem was less of a problem, because you're 15 to 18 km/h slower in those corners with full tanks. We'll just have to make sure we get the parts stiffer now." In the slow and medium speed corners you even gain time on the Mercedes. In addition, Red Bull doesn't benefit as much from the altitude of the track 670 metres above sea level as in previous years. Mercedes has successfully improved its weak spot. Honda is using new turbochargers this year and is giving up its advantage in thinner air. But they hope to be better off with the rest.

seense
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Jaisonas wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 09:56
https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... spielberg/
Red Bull sees opportunities against Mercedes: Aero problem slowed the start - AMuS

Translation DeepL:
Analysis has shown that some aerodynamic components have twisted too much under the high lateral acceleration. For example the underbody. That caused a stall. [/b]
And they find out now?? After days of testing? Or part of the upgrade?

Eryngii
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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https://en.hondaracingf1.com/races/2020 ... rix-2.html
Tanabe-san:
The problems on the two Aston Martin Red Bull Racing cars in the last race were both electrical, but caused by different issues.
We have been analysing both these matters together with the teams and we have put countermeasures in place for this weekend.
As our power units do not have any damage caused by those issues, Max and Alex will use their same PU's this weekend.

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Wouter
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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seense wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 10:33
Jaisonas wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 09:56
https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... spielberg/
Red Bull sees opportunities against Mercedes: Aero problem slowed the start - AMuS

Translation DeepL:
Analysis has shown that some aerodynamic components have twisted too much under the high lateral acceleration. For example the underbody. That caused a stall. [/b]
And they find out now?? After days of testing? Or part of the upgrade?
Calm down. :D These were parts of the upgrade. New parts are on the way to Spielberg.
The Power of Dreams!

Chicane
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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There is hardly anything significant between engine manufacturers [ bar Ferrari :D ] now when it comes to outright performance in qualifying mode so Marko should stop sniping at Honda imho.
Quickshifter

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Wouter
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Image
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The Power of Dreams!

Ground Effect
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Q: (Stefano Mancini – La Stampa) Kimi, will you help Vettel to win his championship this year?
Kimi Raikkonen: I can only drive one car, obviously. 
@2018 Singapore Grand Prix drivers press conference.

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ME4ME
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Highly interesting quotes if you ask me. Makes a lot of sense.
These issues wouldn't have shown in CFD or the wind tunnel because the models aren't pulling any G's. At pre-season testing in Barcelona the cars did, but then maybe not in combination with the track falling away and those kerbs. They might've had full correlation aerodynamically, simulation data matching reality in perfect conditions. But now they've found conditions that ruin that, and the car stalls aerodynamically. Possibly they could've prevented this had they used the kerb data and historical data to extract the exact frequency range put through the car and done a modal analysis, but yeah easier said than done if you want to get it right. They then would've needed to put the deformed shape of the surfaces through CFD and wind tunnel to fully know the outcome and its effect on the car, and wouldn've seen the stalling occure.

Actually Red Bull have been historically pushing the boundaries with this.. Last year they tested running the car without tension bars connection the rear section of the floor to the gearbox at pre-season testing. Everyone has had those for years, out of necessity to keep the floor from deflecting too much. Eventually Red Bull showed up at the first race with these tension bars. Their attempt hadn't worked.

Anyway the impressive thing is that they clearly identified the stalling problem, the parts that are causing it and the corners in which the stall occurs. They probably did that over the weekend, possibly after qualifying but more likely after the race once they had all the data, with different fuel loads and therefor different cornering speeds. They then had about four days to introduce counter meassures. So that probably means first a bunch of iterations between CAD work and FE-analysis to settle on a sufficiently stiff geometry which ultimately will mean thicker bodies. This will then have to go into CFD for analysis, the thicker bodies will likely slightly decrease performance in optimal conditions. Further alternations to the geometry might be needed. Once satisfied it needs to go into the wind tunnel for validation, for that there needs to be drawings produced and 60%-scale parts manufactured. Probably using some form of rapid prototyping. Then the real parts needs to be manufactured, possibly carbon items that need to be in the autoclave for some hours. They then have to go through validation and NDT testing. If all OK, ship to the track asap for testing on one of the cars in FP1. They likely send another batch to arrive on saturday morning.

Once it's friday and FP1 begins, the driver hit a massive yellow kerb on his outlap and the parts are all ruined :D

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Big Tea
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Joined: 24 Dec 2017, 20:57

Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Ground Effect wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 11:23
Honda introducing countermeasures
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/vers ... =widget-22
This weekend, we must aim to finish the race with all four cars
So we read that as conservative then?
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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etusch
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Big Tea wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 13:24
Ground Effect wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 11:23
Honda introducing countermeasures
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/vers ... =widget-22
This weekend, we must aim to finish the race with all four cars
So we read that as conservative then?
I prefer to read it as same issue will not accur there

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Big Tea
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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etusch wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 13:42
Big Tea wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 13:24
Ground Effect wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 11:23
Honda introducing countermeasures
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/vers ... =widget-22
This weekend, we must aim to finish the race with all four cars
So we read that as conservative then?
I prefer to read it as same issue will not accur there
The emphases on 'all four cars' sounds like they feel unfairly blamed and need to get their score of clean races up more than giving the highest output regardless. Marco also seems to be saying Honda are not taking enough risks, but they want their reputation after the Mclaren years.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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etusch
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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Big Tea wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 13:52
etusch wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 13:42
Big Tea wrote:
09 Jul 2020, 13:24


This weekend, we must aim to finish the race with all four cars
So we read that as conservative then?
I prefer to read it as same issue will not accur there
The emphases on 'all four cars' sounds like they feel unfairly blamed and need to get their score of clean races up more than giving the highest output regardless. Marco also seems to be saying Honda are not taking enough risks, but they want their reputation after the Mclaren years.
there may be something like that but Honda engines have been working very reliabily so they must be talking about electric issue.

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etusch
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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According to the special news of Motorsport Germany editor Christian Nimmervoll, who was the first to announce that Sebastian Vettel will leave Ferrari, Dietrich Mateschitz, owner of Red Bull, ordered Helmut Marko to "bring Sebastian Vettel back".
https://tr.motorsport.com/f1/news/mates ... n=widget-1

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ME4ME
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Re: [ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

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I think Red Bull will play this slow. They have time on their hands and surely they will want to see how both Vettel and Albon perform over the coming races.