2020 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, July 17-19

[V12-POWER]

Already any ideas what that mysterious puff of smoke coming out of Mercedes powered cars might be? Significant power advantage in party mode combined with smoke. That was enough to be highly suspicious not so long ago. I would be surprised if none of the teams would do anything to clear that up.

Nobody seems to be giving a f@ck about it. Everybody noticed the Ferraris smoking 2 years ago and we all know how that went. I guess even if Mercedes is 5 seconds ahead of everyone, nobody will raise an eyebrow because it will be ingenious and innovative.

exactly lol. Imagine Ferrari qualifying 1 second ahead of everyone.

When Mercedes does it, they’re geniuses, a example of superior harmony, peace and teamwork.

Had Ferrari done it, they would have been catalogued as the lowest of the low and above all, shameless cheaters

With today’s qualifying it’s clear that Mercedes is up to something or should I say many-things regarding their cars-chassis-engine, this isn’t the 80s neither 2014. I can’t believe no one finds it suspicious at all

And then you have Racing Point and a 1:1 copy with slight modifications on the floor and wing end plates. Oh major difference, there is no way they’re the same car!

This year is incredible, I’m really keen to see how much bs the audience and the teams will cope before the “bubble” bursts - much more interesting that the racing itself lol

[Phil]

Personally, I think I was less 'agitated' in 2011 & 2013 than some seem to be now regarding Mercedes's domination. Sure, it's easier to endure when it's your team that's doing all the winning; But I have matured to the point, that I appreciate more than just who crosses the line in 1st place, just as in 2011 & 2013, there was heaps going on to keep me hooked.

And as a side point; before I became a Hamilton fan, I was a Sauber fan (you know, supporting the home-team with its factory just 50km from where I live). I couldn't care less about what Michael was winning at the time, my sole focus was the team puddling around in the midfield (which of course changed when BMW entered).

I hate bringing up Tennis, but obviously, I'm a Federer fan, but that doesn't stop me watching and enjoying the game of the countless other players. To the point; my focus tomorrow will be less on Hamilton/Bottas, but I'm way more excited in the many intra team battles up and down the grid (for example Vettel/Leclerc). I just don't get the obsession anymore about who wins every single race, as there are 9 other teams and 19 other drivers too.

And while the chances will be big that Mercedes may dominate next year as they will this year, I'm not going to put it past RedBull or even Ferrari to close the gap somewhat.

[Schuttelberg]

Personally, I think I was less 'agitated' in 2011 & 2013 than some seem to be now regarding Mercedes's domination. Sure, it's easier to endure when it's your team that's doing all the winning; But I have matured to the point, that I appreciate more than just who crosses the line in 1st place, just as in 2011 & 2013, there was heaps going on to keep me hooked.

And as a side point; before I became a Hamilton fan, I was a Sauber fan (you know, supporting the home-team with its factory just 50km from where I live). I couldn't care less about what Michael was winning at the time, my sole focus was the team puddling around in the midfield (which of course changed when BMW entered).

I hate bringing up Tennis, but obviously, I'm a Federer fan, but that doesn't stop me watching and enjoying the game of the countless other players. To the point; my focus tomorrow will be less on Hamilton/Bottas, but I'm way more excited in the many intra team battles up and down the grid (for example Vettel/Leclerc). I just don't get the obsession anymore about who wins every single race, as there are 9 other teams and 19 other drivers too.

And while the chances will be big that Mercedes may dominate next year as they will this year, I'm not going to put it past RedBull or even Ferrari to close the gap somewhat.

I mean, I am not going to judge you. To each his own. For me, all performances up and down the grid matter. If you dig into this thread itself, I was jumping up and down about George. But, but, the battle for a race win will make your heart rate dance. I know mine does. It just doesn't tingle for a P5 P6 or whatever. My feelings in season finale's of 2008, 2010 and my lord above knows the absolute mess I was in 2000 and 2012.. it's easy to say we just don't care but in the end we all do.

And I was also a BMW supporter. So we found common ground somewhere.. it's funny how I was desperate for Vettel to sign for them and not Red Bull.

[SmallSoldier]

Personally, I think I was less 'agitated' in 2011 & 2013 than some seem to be now regarding Mercedes's domination. Sure, it's easier to endure when it's your team that's doing all the winning; But I have matured to the point, that I appreciate more than just who crosses the line in 1st place, just as in 2011 & 2013, there was heaps going on to keep me hooked.

And as a side point; before I became a Hamilton fan, I was a Sauber fan (you know, supporting the home-team with its factory just 50km from where I live). I couldn't care less about what Michael was winning at the time, my sole focus was the team puddling around in the midfield (which of course changed when BMW entered).

I hate bringing up Tennis, but obviously, I'm a Federer fan, but that doesn't stop me watching and enjoying the game of the countless other players. To the point; my focus tomorrow will be less on Hamilton/Bottas, but I'm way more excited in the many intra team battles up and down the grid (for example Vettel/Leclerc). I just don't get the obsession anymore about who wins every single race, as there are 9 other teams and 19 other drivers too.

And while the chances will be big that Mercedes may dominate next year as they will this year, I'm not going to put it past RedBull or even Ferrari to close the gap somewhat.

I mean, I am not going to judge you. To each his own. For me, all performances up and down the grid matter. If you dig into this thread itself, I was jumping up and down about George. But, but, the battle for a race win will make your heart rate dance. I know mine does. It just doesn't tingle for a P5 P6 or whatever. My feelings in season finale's of 2008, 2010 and my lord above knows the absolute mess I was in 2000 and 2012.. it's easy to say we just don't care but in the end we all do.

And I was also a BMW supporter. So we found common ground somewhere.. it's funny how I was desperate for Vettel to sign for them and not Red Bull.

I guess it depends on who you cheer for? I mean... Back in 2015-2017... I will jump of my seat if McLaren was finishing 10th in a race... Last week my heart was racing when Norris was closing the gap to RIC and Stroll and was watching the times and gaps and in disbelief that he could actually get Perez before the race was over... Or the previous week watching “Last Lap Norris” closing the gap and managing to get in within 5 seconds of Hamilton

Was it for the win? No... But it felt like one... Was I bothered that that Mercedes won? Not at all... I’m enjoying not only the fight in the middle, but also what appears to be improvement from McLaren, a team that I have followed in excess of 30 years.

Beyond the racing... My race week “used to start” on Wednesday going into the forums, Twitter, Reddit, Websites and every other form of media to find out about new developments of parts from the teams... Big part of the reason why I spent a not too healthy amount of time lurking around here also.

Mercedes will dominate this season, will dominate the next one and it’s amazing to see how much that team can achieve and how hungry they seem to always be regardless of what is probably already historical success... And I most probably be around when they get dethroned too


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[Polarit]

F1 has always had dominant teams and they usually align with the dominant driver of that era. Hamilton I think through his driving earnt the right to have a car capable of winning. The only other driver who I think deserved a quick car has been Alonso but that's the way things go. Did Vettel deserve the Red Bull he got...... It's debatable.

Hamilton has always been one of the best on the grid since he started and he took a huge gamble to go with Mercedes and was mocked for doing it so you reap what you sow.

I think with F1 it's a sport and technical exercise. I wish we got more insight into the team side of things because that's the most impressive side of it from dominant teams to technical maverick seasons like Brawn.

I'm not sure Bottas really has it in him to beat Hamilton. He's not even got into the mind game stage...... I think Mercedes know this.

Rosberg was different and he should be given so much praise for doing what he did. Luck was needed but he put everything into it and got his championship. Way more impressive than say Button who beat Hamilton because he basically took the safe option.

I think just appreciate for the technical dominance Mercedes reign and Hamilton's era like Schumacher....... it'll end with the next rule change. But it's mighty impressive.

The performance and car this year..... just a different level and they've got the champion of this era to bring it home everytime. It's just an era in sport, there's no use tryinging to bring it down just appreciate it.

[dans79]

This is really going to chafe some people.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15067 ... 21-updates

A potential loophole in the FIA's new development token system will allow Racing Point and AlphaTauri to make significant upgrades to their Formula 1 cars without deploying tokens.

If a customer team takes a part that its supplying team has deployed tokens on to upgrade it, the customer also has to give up its tokens in order to be allowed to use it.

However, customer teams currently using 2019 parts can upgrade to the original 2020 versions of used by their partner teams without using their own tokens for 2021; Racing Point, which currently uses the 2019 Mercedes gearbox, would be able to make a token-free switch to the 2020 unit.

It can also take other key elements, such as suspension components and hydraulic, steering and braking systems from the 2020 Mercedes, with its two tokens free for another area of the 2021 car.

Although Racing Point would be getting technology that is already in use on the 2020 Mercedes the changes would potentially represent a step in performance for the Silverstone team in 2021 from where it is currently.

AlphaTauri is in a similar position, and can also trade its 2019 Red Bull gearbox and other elements to the 2020 spec currently used by RBR.

[SmallSoldier]

This is really going to chafe some people.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15067 ... 21-updates

A potential loophole in the FIA's new development token system will allow Racing Point and AlphaTauri to make significant upgrades to their Formula 1 cars without deploying tokens.

If a customer team takes a part that its supplying team has deployed tokens on to upgrade it, the customer also has to give up its tokens in order to be allowed to use it.

However, customer teams currently using 2019 parts can upgrade to the original 2020 versions of used by their partner teams without using their own tokens for 2021; Racing Point, which currently uses the 2019 Mercedes gearbox, would be able to make a token-free switch to the 2020 unit.

It can also take other key elements, such as suspension components and hydraulic, steering and braking systems from the 2020 Mercedes, with its two tokens free for another area of the 2021 car.

Although Racing Point would be getting technology that is already in use on the 2020 Mercedes the changes would potentially represent a step in performance for the Silverstone team in 2021 from where it is currently.

AlphaTauri is in a similar position, and can also trade its 2019 Red Bull gearbox and other elements to the 2020 spec currently used by RBR.

This will definitely stir up some @#$ from a few teams


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[PlatinumZealot]

The four Mercedes teams on softs. Its going to be four car barricade blocking any and all opposers to the order.

In hungary track position is king until the field thins out. Looking at midfield gaps it will take some time. Unfortunately a bunch of guys on softs will struggle a bit and will be forced to an early stop back into traffic.

[GPR-A]

Already any ideas what that mysterious puff of smoke coming out of Mercedes powered cars might be? Significant power advantage in party mode combined with smoke. That was enough to be highly suspicious not so long ago. I would be surprised if none of the teams would do anything to clear that up.

Nobody seems to be giving a f@ck about it. Everybody noticed the Ferraris smoking 2 years ago and we all know how that went. I guess even if Mercedes is 5 seconds ahead of everyone, nobody will raise an eyebrow because it will be ingenious and innovative.

exactly lol. Imagine Ferrari qualifying 1 second ahead of everyone.

When Mercedes does it, they’re geniuses, a example of superior harmony, peace and teamwork.

Had Ferrari done it, they would have been catalogued as the lowest of the low and above all, shameless cheaters

With today’s qualifying it’s clear that Mercedes is up to something or should I say many-things regarding their cars-chassis-engine, this isn’t the 80s neither 2014. I can’t believe no one finds it suspicious at all

And then you have Racing Point and a 1:1 copy with slight modifications on the floor and wing end plates. Oh major difference, there is no way they’re the same car!

This year is incredible, I’m really keen to see how much bs the audience and the teams will cope before the “bubble” bursts - much more interesting that the racing itself lol

FIA can't catch anyone. It's the teams that have to help FIA find evidence of cheating. It was Mercedes that did all the work for FIA which brought the second fuel sensor that has nipped Ferrari. Similarly if anyone has doubts about the legality of Mercedes car, it's up to that team to gather evidence and convince the FIA.

[Schuttelberg]

This is really going to chafe some people.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/15067 ... 21-updates

A potential loophole in the FIA's new development token system will allow Racing Point and AlphaTauri to make significant upgrades to their Formula 1 cars without deploying tokens.

If a customer team takes a part that its supplying team has deployed tokens on to upgrade it, the customer also has to give up its tokens in order to be allowed to use it.

However, customer teams currently using 2019 parts can upgrade to the original 2020 versions of used by their partner teams without using their own tokens for 2021; Racing Point, which currently uses the 2019 Mercedes gearbox, would be able to make a token-free switch to the 2020 unit.

It can also take other key elements, such as suspension components and hydraulic, steering and braking systems from the 2020 Mercedes, with its two tokens free for another area of the 2021 car.

Although Racing Point would be getting technology that is already in use on the 2020 Mercedes the changes would potentially represent a step in performance for the Silverstone team in 2021 from where it is currently.

AlphaTauri is in a similar position, and can also trade its 2019 Red Bull gearbox and other elements to the 2020 spec currently used by RBR.

This will definitely stir up some @#$ from a few teams


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Cyril Irritable is going to get more irritable now.

[foxmulder_ms]

Already any ideas what that mysterious puff of smoke coming out of Mercedes powered cars might be? Significant power advantage in party mode combined with smoke. That was enough to be highly suspicious not so long ago. I would be surprised if none of the teams would do anything to clear that up.

There is no significant power advantage. Merc is faster than anyone else *especially* in the corners!! Merc has basically the same power in last three years. You think Horner isnt dying to find smt like this?!?!?

[sosic2121]

Then you are a very poor observer. I ain't bashing Max. I wanted Max to put up a real challenge to Hamilton this year. It would have been great to watch. Unfortunately Redbull has decided to put all their eggs in one basket and it is just not working.

Max would have won the first race in Austria. He maximised the second race. His position against Hamilton has nothing to do with him, only the fact that nobody is near the Mercedes.

If anyone is looking at the last 2 races and this qualifying and saying any of the drivers aren't up to the mark compared to the Mercedes drivers they don't understand our sport. The championship positions are decided. 1 and 2 and the WCC. In equal cars or even a slightly slower car, Verstappen will eat Bottas alive. Hamilton is a whole different matter.

Vest can "eat" Bottas in Redbull, 100%. I am not sure if he can beat him in Mercedes If Bottas (or Nico Rosberg for that matter) were in Redbull (or Ferrari) they could hardly won any races forget about championship. Merc is the only team who gives equal treatment to its drivers until a clear front runner appears.

[koenigzig]

Already any ideas what that mysterious puff of smoke coming out of Mercedes powered cars might be? Significant power advantage in party mode combined with smoke. That was enough to be highly suspicious not so long ago. I would be surprised if none of the teams would do anything to clear that up.

There is no significant power advantage. Merc is faster than anyone else *especially* in the corners!! Merc has basically the same power in last three years. You think Horner isnt dying to find smt like this?!?!?

Firstly, hello everyone. Finally signed up after lurking for a while.

@fox Red Bull stated that the Mercedes engine has improved significantly this year

https://www.grandprix.com/news/honda-no ... -2020.html

[JRindt]

....To add to that the relentless trolling by their boss every fortnight....

I think this gets me the most. I mean both merc drivers come out after the qualifying and say they were ‘shocked’ by the gap to RedBull. Really? We weren’t

[mafeotul]

....To add to that the relentless trolling by their boss every fortnight....

I think this gets me the most. I mean both merc drivers come out after the qualifying and say they were ‘shocked’ by the gap to RedBull. Really? We weren’t

Thing is, without real competition, they probably don’t know the margin they are ahead, eve though they know they are, if that makes sense. Imagine Barcelona playing against La Liga 2 teams for 4 years only. They would not know necessarily where they stand against someone at the same level. Plus, playing the under-achiever card seems to have pushed a lot of scrutiny away from Mercedes. If it took the entire Merc and Redbull engineering departments to figure the Ferrari engine trickery, it would take a lot to discover what Merc is doing with theirs. Even as their fan i am 150% certain something is up with that car. To pull 1.2 seconds on your W10, where that car was the king of downforce, on a downforce sensitive track.. seems the entire chassis is swimming in grey areas. I’ll wait for Monza to see the gaps, because that PU which seems to have awoken even the relegation Williams, is probably the Pandora's box for this year.