On a different Note Wolff and Mercedes Board are pondering what to do with Niki Lauda's shares.... Perhaps Lewis could make a proposal?
https://www.planetf1.com/news/liverpool ... oto-wolff/
It's a good way to get around the salary cap, just pay the driver in company shares.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 14:23On a different Note Wolff and Mercedes Board are pondering what to do with Niki Lauda's shares.... Perhaps Lewis could make a proposal?
https://www.planetf1.com/news/liverpool ... oto-wolff/
It would be better for his development for him to be moved to a midfield team but, as long as Mercedes is at the front (clear or battling), then I think it makes sense for Russell to just bide his time.Schuttelberg wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 16:09The interesting bit will happen next year if Russell isn't promoted because I think that kid is being wasted in that Williams and I don't see him hanging around waiting on Mercedes forever.
Somehow I am getting sure that most of you guys are British... that would clarify all comments.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 14:21I am a little confused too. So your claim then, is that Bottas is designated number 2, but he is allowed to steal points of Hamilton until somepoint (which i hope you specify) in the championship where he must pull aside if Hamilton's WDC is in danger?Unf wrote: ↑22 Jul 2020, 00:06Do you really think that I am talking about doing it - like that - in 1st race? How can I take your comment serious then?El Scorchio wrote: ↑21 Jul 2020, 23:37You mean like in the Austrian Grand Prix, when Bottas was ahead and the Mercedes team did...... NOTHING to ‘stop’ him?
Even after Hamilton got his penalty they could have ordered Bottas to let him past to even preserve second place for their ‘preferred driver’. But they didn’t. If Mercedes favoured Hamilton above Bottas then they’d have let him past.
Your argument just makes no sense.
It is obvious that I was reffering to situation when Hamilton's WDC would be in danger - then Mercedes are going to do everything for bringing Lewis back to the top, including put Bottas behind if he would be ahead of Ham.
Ps: Jackles-UK - thanks for reasonable post, 1st there from long time.
This is confusing! This is not a number 2 arrangement! This a normal affair between teammates. In a number 2 arrangement Bottas would have to pull aside whether or not Hamilon's WDC is in danger. And as a matter of fact if for whatever reason Hamilton's WDC was in danger by Bottas! himself, Bottas would not even be allowed to lead the race before the first round of pitstops. That is a number 2 contract.
I have never seen contracted Number 2 situation at Mercedes.
Trust me, Hamilton is not universally liked in Britain. Far from it. Many hate his guts even though they've never met him.
I would jump with glee if HAM got a number 2 so all those records with fall... But.. I recognized, and he himself has stated, that he has no such thing in his contracts. He has taken pride in that all his teammates are given equal opportunity. He has said on a few occassions that Alonso, Vettel and Max had number 1 in their contracts. Not sure how true this is, but there is some truth to it since none of those drivers ever refuted it.
Hamilton joined a championship winning team on debut and drove a car capable of winning it. Why should Russell have to spend more years floundering around for podiums and wins if he can entice a team like RBR? This logic of bedding them in or warming them up is really over rated and devoid of facts.Wynters wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 16:33It would be better for his development for him to be moved to a midfield team but, as long as Mercedes is at the front (clear or battling), then I think it makes sense for Russell to just bide his time.Schuttelberg wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 16:09The interesting bit will happen next year if Russell isn't promoted because I think that kid is being wasted in that Williams and I don't see him hanging around waiting on Mercedes forever.
If you believe you have the talent to win a WDC, then it's all about being in the right car. On a rare year, there may be two 'right' cars but for there's generally only one and, right now, the smart money seems to be on Mercedes being right up there. I think I'd rather gamble on spending eight years at Williams and then two years in a Mercedes than end up on the Ricciardo / Kubica route. That would change if someone younger and fast came up through the Mercedes ranks though.
One thing I would do as Toto, is make sure Russell is promoted at least one year before Hamilton retires. The opportunity for knowledge transfer (active or passive) is just too great.
But we still love you anyway...
Agree with the first part. If Russell is up to it (like Hamilton was) then he'll just flourish straight away. The best drivers are the ones who can be put in any car and almost immediately understand it and get the maximum possible performance from it. My feeling is we've seen that from Russell over his career so far. I don't think he needs to spend time in a midfield team. It certainly did LeClerc and Verstappen no harm to be fast tracked into high performing equipment and they'v largely handled it very well. Some drivers may crack under pressure but I don't see Russell as one of those.Schuttelberg wrote: ↑30 Jul 2020, 03:38Hamilton joined a championship winning team on debut and drove a car capable of winning it. Why should Russell have to spend more years floundering around for podiums and wins if he can entice a team like RBR? This logic of bedding them in or warming them up is really over rated and devoid of facts.Wynters wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 16:33It would be better for his development for him to be moved to a midfield team but, as long as Mercedes is at the front (clear or battling), then I think it makes sense for Russell to just bide his time.Schuttelberg wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 16:09The interesting bit will happen next year if Russell isn't promoted because I think that kid is being wasted in that Williams and I don't see him hanging around waiting on Mercedes forever.
If you believe you have the talent to win a WDC, then it's all about being in the right car. On a rare year, there may be two 'right' cars but for there's generally only one and, right now, the smart money seems to be on Mercedes being right up there. I think I'd rather gamble on spending eight years at Williams and then two years in a Mercedes than end up on the Ricciardo / Kubica route. That would change if someone younger and fast came up through the Mercedes ranks though.
One thing I would do as Toto, is make sure Russell is promoted at least one year before Hamilton retires. The opportunity for knowledge transfer (active or passive) is just too great.
You are also basing everything on the assumption that Mercedes will dominate the sport for another 10 years. For you to suggest that Russell should perhaps even spend another 5 years at Williams after the next in the hope for a Mercedes drive is totally unrealistic. Mercedes can make another 2014 car and if they keep refuting George, he will jump. Just look at Sainz. History doesn't always mean it tells the future but it does suggest that while Mercedes has been making beasts on the track, their YDP has been a big waste/sham. After Hamilton, they've promoted exactly nobody and Wehrlein and Ocon both were ready for the step up but Bottas continues.
By all means carry on looking for it, but ultimately I think you're searching for things that aren't there. Feel free to share your observations from the upcoming races though.Unf wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 18:17Somehow I am getting sure that most of you guys are British... that would clarify all comments.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑29 Jul 2020, 14:21I am a little confused too. So your claim then, is that Bottas is designated number 2, but he is allowed to steal points of Hamilton until somepoint (which i hope you specify) in the championship where he must pull aside if Hamilton's WDC is in danger?Unf wrote: ↑22 Jul 2020, 00:06
Do you really think that I am talking about doing it - like that - in 1st race? How can I take your comment serious then?
It is obvious that I was reffering to situation when Hamilton's WDC would be in danger - then Mercedes are going to do everything for bringing Lewis back to the top, including put Bottas behind if he would be ahead of Ham.
Ps: Jackles-UK - thanks for reasonable post, 1st there from long time.
This is confusing! This is not a number 2 arrangement! This a normal affair between teammates. In a number 2 arrangement Bottas would have to pull aside whether or not Hamilon's WDC is in danger. And as a matter of fact if for whatever reason Hamilton's WDC was in danger by Bottas! himself, Bottas would not even be allowed to lead the race before the first round of pitstops. That is a number 2 contract.
I have never seen contracted Number 2 situation at Mercedes.
As I said - I don't want to argue anymore, it's worthless. I am just waiting for next races... evidences would be there automatically.
I'm not sure the "competition" is much better in what their YDP achieves. RedBull has effectively put all their eggs in Max's basket - the result being that they lost Daniel Riccardo. Along the way, they have alienated drivers with huge prospects (-> Buemi, Alguarsuari), one of which has continued to be very successful.Schuttelberg wrote: ↑30 Jul 2020, 03:38History doesn't always mean it tells the future but it does suggest that while Mercedes has been making beasts on the track, their YDP has been a big waste/sham. After Hamilton, they've promoted exactly nobody and Wehrlein and Ocon both were ready for the step up but Bottas continues.