McLaren F1 successor

[Morteza]

[pierrre]

the engine on that t.50 is something else

[Morteza]

[Morteza]

[J.A.W.]

Curious how Cosworth has their V12's 6 exhaust headers on each bank, grouped.

Cylinders 1-3-5 & 2-4-6 feed their individual pipes into a pair of collectors.

Unusual, since for packaging convenience, 1-2-3 & 4-5-6 is a typical set-up,
or if, when space allows, an equal-length triple grouping of 1-6, 2-4, 3-5.

Seems the Cosworth team has sought to more closely-group the firing impulses,
but in a way which allows a consecutive group-pulse from each tri-collector...

[Morteza]

[Cold Fussion]

Presumably after the suction point, the diffuser angle can no longer exceed the standard critical angle?

[Stu]

Presumably after the suction point, the diffuser angle can no longer exceed the standard critical angle?

It doesn’t need to as the diffuser fills the space, it can be horizontal. It becomes all about the volume of the diffuser space.

After watching I was left with two questions...

1) What effect would running the fan backwards be?
Would it be beneficial for drag reduction?

2) How exactly are they making this happen on F1 cars (as the diffusers on most appear to be maximising the legal space).
I can think of a few ways, but not sure how legal any of them would be!!

[jjn9128]

Does anyone have pictures of the actual diffuser? I'm assuming it's like one or two perforated sections similar to the McLaren F1.

[Morteza]

[Just_a_fan]

I'm looking forward to seeing this car hit the road. I think the comparison tests that the journos will undoubtedly do will be interesting. Chris Harris driving this back to back with the usual suspects from Ferrari, Porsche and McLaren should be a great watch.

[the EDGE]

I'm looking forward to seeing this car hit the road. I think the comparison tests that the journos will undoubtedly do will be interesting. Chris Harris driving this back to back with the usual suspects from Ferrari, Porsche and McLaren should be a great watch.

It will certainly be interesting to see how this tech transfers to the real world

From what I understand the fans don’t increase the downforce per se, like the F1 BT46 did, but works to remove the boundary layer from the diffuser to increase low-speed downforce giving the effect a much wider working range, or operating in reverse to reduce high-speed drag

A very interesting concept indeed, given other downforce based road cars require quite a bit of speed to notice the full effect of the downforce

[Just_a_fan]

From what I understand the fans don’t increase the downforce per se, like the F1 BT46 did, but works to remove the boundary layer from the diffuser to increase low-speed downforce giving the effect a much wider working range, or operating in reverse to reduce high-speed drag

Murray stated that switching to "high downforce mode" instantly gives a 50% increase in downforce. Which is quite impressive. As you say, it doesn't work like the race car did because you can't seal a road car to the road. But the fan pulls air from the stagnation zone in the diffuser and just makes it work better. But there's also a low drag mode that gives a 12.5% reduction in drag. Now that's a real world application that would pay dividends across the board. Imagine if we could reduce the drag of every car on the road today by 12.5%. That would be a big saving in fuel and thus emissions.

I think it's a great piece of engineering that should give a nudge to other manufacturers to do properly clever stuff.

[the EDGE]

From what I understand the fans don’t increase the downforce per se, like the F1 BT46 did, but works to remove the boundary layer from the diffuser to increase low-speed downforce giving the effect a much wider working range, or operating in reverse to reduce high-speed drag

Murray stated that switching to "high downforce mode" instantly gives a 50% increase in downforce. Which is quite impressive. As you say, it doesn't work like the race car did because you can't seal a road car to the road. But the fan pulls air from the stagnation zone in the diffuser and just makes it work better. But there's also a low drag mode that gives a 12.5% reduction in drag. Now that's a real world application that would pay dividends across the board. Imagine if we could reduce the drag of every car on the road today by 12.5%. That would be a big saving in fuel and thus emissions.

I think it's a great piece of engineering that should give a nudge to other manufacturers to do properly clever stuff.

Yes but you don’t get air stagnation and separation at high speeds, only low speeds

The exhaust blow diffusers added energy to the stream to increase its effectiveness where this effectively removes air from the stream helping stay attached so increases effectiveness

[Just_a_fan]

From what I understand the fans don’t increase the downforce per se, like the F1 BT46 did, but works to remove the boundary layer from the diffuser to increase low-speed downforce giving the effect a much wider working range, or operating in reverse to reduce high-speed drag

Murray stated that switching to "high downforce mode" instantly gives a 50% increase in downforce. Which is quite impressive. As you say, it doesn't work like the race car did because you can't seal a road car to the road. But the fan pulls air from the stagnation zone in the diffuser and just makes it work better. But there's also a low drag mode that gives a 12.5% reduction in drag. Now that's a real world application that would pay dividends across the board. Imagine if we could reduce the drag of every car on the road today by 12.5%. That would be a big saving in fuel and thus emissions.

I think it's a great piece of engineering that should give a nudge to other manufacturers to do properly clever stuff.

Yes but you don’t get air stagnation and separation at high speeds, only low speeds

The exhaust blow diffusers added energy to the stream to increase its effectiveness where this effectively removes air from the stream helping stay attached so increases effectiveness

No, on a heavily reflex diffuser such as fitted to the T.50, you get separation at all speeds because the change in direction is too big for the air to follow it naturally. The fan works against that to remove the dirty air in the reflex section and make the diffuser work better at all speeds. There's a nice little video earlier in the thread where Murray shows this on a white board.