2021 Mclaren F1 Team

[FittingMechanics]

I mean, it's a nothing burger.

I'm sure, almost every team will say the same thing, 50% or more will fail to make it to the next step..

Coming from him and McLaren who downplayed their chances in last few years it is something. It shows a change in perception and direction they want to project. Hopefully it means that they have a good feeling they will make a step up (perhaps understanding Mercedes engine will give them 0.x seconds per lap) and not that it is just PR talk.

We'll see in a couple of months.

[Tizz]

I think Red Bull need to be at their best otherwise McLaren will happily take over their spot in the order. They showed a nice and steady improvement since Seidl came in and I really like the driver line-up. Let's wait and see...

[Ground Effect]

I think Red Bull need to be at their best otherwise McLaren will happily take over their spot in the order. They showed a nice and steady improvement since Seidl came in and I really like the driver line-up. Let's wait and see...

I’m pretty sure the gap to Red Bull is too big to trouble them this season, because if you’re racing Red Bull, you’re effectively racing Mercedes and nobody is expecting that. It’ll likely be an almighty scrap for P3. McLaren, Aston, Ferrari, Alpine and maybe Alpha Tauri.

[Emag]

I think Red Bull need to be at their best otherwise McLaren will happily take over their spot in the order. They showed a nice and steady improvement since Seidl came in and I really like the driver line-up. Let's wait and see...

I’m pretty sure the gap to Red Bull is too big to trouble them this season, because if you’re racing Red Bull, you’re effectively racing Mercedes and nobody is expecting that. It’ll likely be an almighty scrap for P3. McLaren, Aston, Ferrari, Alpine and maybe Alpha Tauri.

This. Not sure why people are expecting so much this season. You guys should know that the relative improvement from 2019 to 2020 was about 0.2% (compared to Mercedes), so McLaren didn't really make that huge of a step last year towards Mercedes. But McLaren (and pretty much every other midfield team) were somewhat flattered last year because of Ferrari's struggles and Albon's inability to drive the RedBull to its potential.

If we go on with the 2019-2020 improvement as a reference you shouldn't really expect a massive step forward at all this year. With relatively stable regulations on the other hand, it is pretty much a given that it is highly likely that the grid will remain somewhat static this year (apart from Ferrari, who might jump a couple of places because they problems last year were in part due to the underpowered engine, and that's fixed this year).

So depending on how much Ferrari was able to claw back in terms of chassis performance (because they should be there or thereabouts with the engine), McLaren is looking to battle for 3rd / 4th this year. Aston Martin and Alpine probably in that group as well, so it is definitely not going to be easy to get 3rd / 4th again.

If people want to expect wins / frequent podiums then keep your hopes up for 2022, because that's the best chance any other team is going to get. It's a matter of who get's the new regulations right. (And even then, Ferrari, Mercedes and RedBull are expected to be towards the front of the grid)

[Chicane]

There are 6 factors which may enable Mclaren to hustle Redbull at least on certain tracks.

1] The top two had very complicated aero slots/creases/cuts/bits along the sides of the floor which will be banned this season. The loss of performance relatively will be more for those two.

2] The new tyres will add a new dimension.

3] New PU for Mclaren has allowed Mclaren to make extensive changes to their chassis and some of those changes will have concomitant aero benefits as well. Mclaren have a much tighter packaging as well.

4] New PU will bring at least two to three tenths in terms of race pace.

5] Daniel Ricciardo is a top tier driver who will definitely be a big asset.

6] Mclaren brought forward their slim nose which means they are the only team with a different front end and a rear end this season.

[djos]

I totally agree. Mclaren now have the best PU and a hugely inspirational, top tier driver to compliment their outstanding leadership team.

Red Bull should be worried imo.

[SmallSoldier]

I think Red Bull need to be at their best otherwise McLaren will happily take over their spot in the order. They showed a nice and steady improvement since Seidl came in and I really like the driver line-up. Let's wait and see...

I’m pretty sure the gap to Red Bull is too big to trouble them this season, because if you’re racing Red Bull, you’re effectively racing Mercedes and nobody is expecting that. It’ll likely be an almighty scrap for P3. McLaren, Aston, Ferrari, Alpine and maybe Alpha Tauri.

This. Not sure why people are expecting so much this season. You guys should know that the relative improvement from 2019 to 2020 was about 0.2% (compared to Mercedes), so McLaren didn't really make that huge of a step last year towards Mercedes. But McLaren (and pretty much every other midfield team) were somewhat flattered last year because of Ferrari's struggles and Albon's inability to drive the RedBull to its potential.

If we go on with the 2019-2020 improvement as a reference you shouldn't really expect a massive step forward at all this year. With relatively stable regulations on the other hand, it is pretty much a given that it is highly likely that the grid will remain somewhat static this year (apart from Ferrari, who might jump a couple of places because they problems last year were in part due to the underpowered engine, and that's fixed this year).

So depending on how much Ferrari was able to claw back in terms of chassis performance (because they should be there or thereabouts with the engine), McLaren is looking to battle for 3rd / 4th this year. Aston Martin and Alpine probably in that group as well, so it is definitely not going to be easy to get 3rd / 4th again.

If people want to expect wins / frequent podiums then keep your hopes up for 2022, because that's the best chance any other team is going to get. It's a matter of who get's the new regulations right. (And even then, Ferrari, Mercedes and RedBull are expected to be towards the front of the grid)

Even though I fully agree with you that expectations of Mclaren fighting Red Bull or even worst Mercedes are too much to ask from the team and that I don’t think it will be the case, the reality is that the stability of the regulations plays more in the hands of the cars in the pack than the lead cars.

Considering that there are diminishing returns, it is conceivable that the top teams (Mercedes, Red Bull) will have it harder to find a massive leap in performance on cars that are very much like last year... Their big advantage usually comes with big changes in regulations since they have the resources to extract more from a brand new package... With stability in the regulations, the rest of the grid should in theory make bigger gains than the top cars... The problem is that the gap to the front was so big that even when the midfield may find more time this season, it won’t be enough to be fighting at the front.

I also believe that there will be quiet a fight for P3, Ferrari will probably make a very sizable jump towards the front of the midfield and wouldn’t be surprised if they show up with a clear third fastest car... It will be a fun fight and I expect it to be not much different than 2020 with AMR and Alpine also in the fight with a potential Alpha Tauri and Alpha Romeo also joining... I just hope Mclaren gained that little much more than the others to be at the front of the pack.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Manoah2u]

Red Bull worried LOL.

Mclaren has a top driver in the shape of Daniel Ricciardo, okay....but he has yet to adapt to this new environment.
And it's not like Daniel is like a mighty Senna or Schumacher or Hamilton moving from a powerhouse to bring them 'what would be missing'. Even if Daniel is better than Sainz, he still finds himself in a new environment and will be driving a car he's never driven before, where he has been driving Renault powered cars afaik almost his entire career.

Mclaren has a new PU, which they had hard work in fitting - seemingly succesfull though - but is a new variable and will bring some issues, inevitably. For all we know they're going to start pre-season testing and run into insolvable overheating problems.

Mclaren's new PU is a Mercedes engine which Aston Martin also have. Or Racing point last year. Did RP beat RBR just because they had a Merc? how about Williams?
It's more likely Mclaren is going to trip with AMR than they will 'challenge' RBR.

Meanwhile, Renault/Alpine hasn't been sitting still, nor have Ferrari, and less have RBR.

I'm all for Mclaren being at the top, but let's really not get ahead of the facts, and the facts are that we still haven't even had pre-season testing,
and another fact is that from the start of pre-season testing untill the moment the lights go out on sunday at race1, there is going to be a whole lot of changes
and alterations in development from all the 'bigger' teams.

Biggest fact: RedBull's latest win was: Last race in 2020, Max Verstappen. Mclaren's last win was: 2012.
Since then they haven't had a win, and even then in 2012 they were beaten by RedBull.
They've been on the back foot ever since 2009.

Meanwhile, RedBull's Max Verstappen has 42 podiums and 10 wins and 1162 career points, vs Ricciardo's 7 wins, 31 podiums and 1159 career points.

Not only does RBR hold better cards, their star driver does too. Checo also holds 1 win, 10 podiums and 706 career points vs Norris' 1 podium and 146 career points.

Honestly, Mclaren probably will have a solid base for 2021, but to concider them a worry for RedBull is really far fetched.


Do i hope to see Daniel grab a win with the Mclaren? Hell yes though!

[Zynerji]

The team that starts 2021 closest to their 2020 downforce levels win.

[the EDGE]

and another fact is that from the start of pre-season testing untill the moment the lights go out on sunday at race1, there is going to be a whole lot of changes
and alterations in development from all the 'bigger' teams.

Not to disagree with anything else you said, but I don’t think there will be many updates for teams between testing & race 1

With the strict limits on design resources and a need by teams to devote as much CFD/wind tunnel time this year to the 2022 cars teams can’t afford to waste anything

Testing weekend was originally planned to be the Melbourne GP so if teams have stuck with their original schedules, which most appear to have done so, their final race spec updates should be ready from the off on the 12th, and It’s not as if there is time between testing and racing to make any significant reactionary changes not already in the pipeline

Far better correlate what you have then assess the upgrades required and introduce at a later date I would have thought

[the EDGE]

The team that starts 2021 closest to their 2020 downforce levels win.

I believe the car with the best aero balance through the widest operating window would come out on top actually.

It’s far more important than peak downforce

[Zynerji]

The team that starts 2021 closest to their 2020 downforce levels win.

I believe the car with the best aero balance through the widest operating window would come out on top actually.

It’s far more important than peak downforce

Except it's slower in qualifying. And P1 is the Clean-Air King in the race.

[diffuser]

I mean, it's a nothing burger.

I'm sure, almost every team will say the same thing, 50% or more will fail to make it to the next step..

Coming from him and McLaren who downplayed their chances in last few years it is something. It shows a change in perception and direction they want to project. Hopefully it means that they have a good feeling they will make a step up (perhaps understanding Mercedes engine will give them 0.x seconds per lap) and not that it is just PR talk.

We'll see in a couple of months.

Doesn't matter what he thinks and I doudt he thinks that. He knows, for example, that even if he thinks McLaren has increased performance 100%, he may show up on race day to find that everyone else has increased by 150%. He doesn't know what everyone else has done.

Like you said, we'll see in Bahrain.

[djos]

I don’t think it’s fair to say Daniel will take time to get used to the new car. Yes this was the case going to Renault, however, the Renault was a huge step down for him, in braking performance in particular.

Mclaren is a step sideways at worst, so I don’t see Daniel taking more than 1 race weekend to get up to speed.

I don’t see Ferrari as a threat, imo it is very unlikely that they can catch up to the Mercedes PU so quickly after spending years cheating instead of following legitimate development paths. If they could have had Mercedes like power via legitimate means, they wouldn’t have had to cheat.

[Ground Effect]

Red Bull worried LOL.

Mclaren has a top driver in the shape of Daniel Ricciardo, okay....but he has yet to adapt to this new environment.
And it's not like Daniel is like a mighty Senna or Schumacher or Hamilton moving from a powerhouse to bring them 'what would be missing'. Even if Daniel is better than Sainz, he still finds himself in a new environment and will be driving a car he's never driven before, where he has been driving Renault powered cars afaik almost his entire career.

Mclaren has a new PU, which they had hard work in fitting - seemingly succesfull though - but is a new variable and will bring some issues, inevitably. For all we know they're going to start pre-season testing and run into insolvable overheating problems.

Mclaren's new PU is a Mercedes engine which Aston Martin also have. Or Racing point last year. Did RP beat RBR just because they had a Merc? how about Williams?
It's more likely Mclaren is going to trip with AMR than they will 'challenge' RBR.

Meanwhile, Renault/Alpine hasn't been sitting still, nor have Ferrari, and less have RBR.

I'm all for Mclaren being at the top, but let's really not get ahead of the facts, and the facts are that we still haven't even had pre-season testing,
and another fact is that from the start of pre-season testing untill the moment the lights go out on sunday at race1, there is going to be a whole lot of changes
and alterations in development from all the 'bigger' teams.

Biggest fact: RedBull's latest win was: Last race in 2020, Max Verstappen. Mclaren's last win was: 2012.
Since then they haven't had a win, and even then in 2012 they were beaten by RedBull.
They've been on the back foot ever since 2009.

Meanwhile, RedBull's Max Verstappen has 42 podiums and 10 wins and 1162 career points, vs Ricciardo's 7 wins, 31 podiums and 1159 career points.

Not only does RBR hold better cards, their star driver does too. Checo also holds 1 win, 10 podiums and 706 career points vs Norris' 1 podium and 146 career points.

Honestly, Mclaren probably will have a solid base for 2021, but to concider them a worry for RedBull is really far fetched.


Do i hope to see Daniel grab a win with the Mclaren? Hell yes though!

Agree with this, except the bit with the irrelevant race wins, podiums and points statistics. That really doesn’t add value to the facts you pointed out, not a like for like comparison.