Silverstone, Hungary and Italy should be better
Probably not as simple as that though. I believe changing to a higher rake will also mean having to change everything else towards the front of the car. Would they also have to tweak the rear suspension itself since it will now be moving at a different range to what it was optimized for?dans79 wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:30If they can increase the rake a little bit, they will be able to better seal the diffuser using the rear brake ducts. That means they can run less rear wing and get the same amount of total downforce.
If you couple that with tweaked, engine maps that are no longer trying to compensate for the high downforce rear wing, and new rear tires that allow them to drop pressures by 2 PSI, that could be a significant performance improvement for them.
If it all came together at the same time I could see that being worth anywhere from three to six tenths a lap.
It all depends on how much change in rake is actually needed. Increasing or decreasing rate really isn't hard, it only becomes hard when you exceed the operating envelope of some component of the car.e30ernest wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:56Probably not as simple as that though. I believe changing to a higher rake will also mean having to change everything else towards the front of the car. Would they also have to tweak the rear suspension itself since it will now be moving at a different range to what it was optimized for?dans79 wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:30If they can increase the rake a little bit, they will be able to better seal the diffuser using the rear brake ducts. That means they can run less rear wing and get the same amount of total downforce.
If you couple that with tweaked, engine maps that are no longer trying to compensate for the high downforce rear wing, and new rear tires that allow them to drop pressures by 2 PSI, that could be a significant performance improvement for them.
If it all came together at the same time I could see that being worth anywhere from three to six tenths a lap.
In actual centimeters, it shouldn't be much especially given the wheelbase of the car I think. However, the car itself is designed to run in particular tolerances. I'd be curious to see what sort of changes they end up with if they run "high rake".dans79 wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 06:19It all depends on how much change in rake is actually needed. Increasing or decreasing rate really isn't hard, it only becomes hard when you exceed the operating envelope of some component of the car.e30ernest wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:56Probably not as simple as that though. I believe changing to a higher rake will also mean having to change everything else towards the front of the car. Would they also have to tweak the rear suspension itself since it will now be moving at a different range to what it was optimized for?dans79 wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:30If they can increase the rake a little bit, they will be able to better seal the diffuser using the rear brake ducts. That means they can run less rear wing and get the same amount of total downforce.
If you couple that with tweaked, engine maps that are no longer trying to compensate for the high downforce rear wing, and new rear tires that allow them to drop pressures by 2 PSI, that could be a significant performance improvement for them.
If it all came together at the same time I could see that being worth anywhere from three to six tenths a lap.
I don't think it would be high rake like Red Bull for example. Just higher rake than what they have traditionally run in the past.e30ernest wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 06:32In actual centimeters, it shouldn't be much especially given the wheelbase of the car I think. However, the car itself is designed to run in particular tolerances. I'd be curious to see what sort of changes they end up with if they run "high rake".dans79 wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 06:19It all depends on how much change in rake is actually needed. Increasing or decreasing rate really isn't hard, it only becomes hard when you exceed the operating envelope of some component of the car.e30ernest wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:56
Probably not as simple as that though. I believe changing to a higher rake will also mean having to change everything else towards the front of the car. Would they also have to tweak the rear suspension itself since it will now be moving at a different range to what it was optimized for?
When he overtook Lando, I heard Lando say on the radio that "his rear brakes are on fire" I don't know if he was referring to his own brakes or Lewis's?cooken wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 15:29Below is a comparison between Ham and Bot. I did a moving average of lap times to smooth things out a bit, excluding in/out laps etc.
Seems like the issue came a couple of laps before the first pit stop. He was immediately slower than Bot at the start of the second stint, both on new hards. Kind of looks like they were managing something beyond lack of downforce or high deg. Possibly something else overheating (eg rear brakes).
I think you're one of the best contributors on this site and you know more about F1 than most of the other people here (including me), so I'm not saying your wrong or anything but if it is physically possible to change the rake without totally redesigning all of the aerodynamics why didn't they do this earlier?dans79 wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 05:30If they can increase the rake a little bit, they will be able to better seal the diffuser using the rear brake ducts. That means they can run less rear wing and get the same amount of total downforce.
If you couple that with tweaked, engine maps that are no longer trying to compensate for the high downforce rear wing, and new rear tires that allow them to drop pressures by 2 PSI, that could be a significant performance improvement for them.
If it all came together at the same time I could see that being worth anywhere from three to six tenths a lap.
I think he meant Hamilton's. So even though they never caught it on television as far as I know, I wonder if the heat from an alleged fire might have been enough for something to come detached or weakened? (and then fail/fall off)Marty_Y wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 16:19When he overtook Lando, I heard Lando say on the radio that "his rear brakes are on fire" I don't know if he was referring to his own brakes or Lewis's?cooken wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 15:29Below is a comparison between Ham and Bot. I did a moving average of lap times to smooth things out a bit, excluding in/out laps etc.
Seems like the issue came a couple of laps before the first pit stop. He was immediately slower than Bot at the start of the second stint, both on new hards. Kind of looks like they were managing something beyond lack of downforce or high deg. Possibly something else overheating (eg rear brakes).