Bush warned before Katrina!!!

Tom · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:11

I have been following this topic with interest, and although I don't like Bush, I find it irritating that we are talking about him here, yet not one of us is doing anything seriouse to stop him.

Sure you can vote against him, but there are still more people who will vote for him for familiarity, better the devil you know.

If Manchild and se7725 really feel that strongly about it, they should do something.

Make no mistake, I have the greatest respect for both of you, esspecially after how much you've helped me in the past couple of days, but you can all do more than just complain about Bush.

Principessa · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:15

Tom, What can we do? The only thing for us to do is have an opinion and express our opinion! As long as we do that, people will hear us and get the chance to think over their own opinion.

I don't really understand what you mean by doing something?

Tom · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:16

Just reread my comment, and wanted to be clear,

Hating Bush is absolutly no reason to go crashing planes into buildings,

If we all did that, I'd be alone out here with only Tomba for company.

Violence is not a way forward.

Also I'm sorry to jgredline, Americans is a far too generalised term,
I'm sure that people from Peru, Chile, Brazil and the rest of South America would not vote for a President who still can't dress himself.

Principessa · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:21

Tom wrote:If we all did that, I'd be alone out here with only Tomba for company.

He's not to fond of Bush either

The thing is...Having an opinion and expressing this opinion, doesn't really mean that we should act like terrorists! I really don't say that believe me...I really was shocked when I saw the images of the twin towers! It's just, that Bush his violence is the cause of violence used against the people of the United States! In this society it's an eye for an eye. And that is really wrong...so the only thing we can do is express or opinion and hope that people in the United States realise what they have done by re-electing this president.

But I say no to ANY kind of violence!!! Don't get me wrong

DaveKillens · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:25

Mr Bush was elected President by his people, and although we may disagree with the man and his policies, we have to try to respect the democratic process. Even though the USA has a long history of not respecting the self-government of other peoples and nations.
I'm a Canadian, and we live in the shadow of our big cousin. We have different cultures and attitudes, as well as goals. But for many years, we liked and respected our neighbour to the south. Like it or not, our histories are linked, we have shared the past, and will share in whatever comes in the future. So trust me, we do have the best interests of all in mind, and do not wish misfortune or an act of terrorism on our neighbour.
But we used to be warm friends, in fact I was born on Oct 14, the same birthday of Dwight David Eisenhower. I was named after that great man.
Many things have come out of the USA, many things that are great and good, great achievements. But ever since Mr Bush has come into power, everything has changed. Intolerance and hate prevail. I have not seen anything nice come from the USA in the last six years. Open contempt for other nations, abuse of international law, and even the systematic torture and killing of other peoples has been allowed to happen in this time period.
Many people support this man and his fearmongering policies. But history will not be kind to him and his kind. It is a step backwards in the progress of the human race and ethical condict for mankind. Sadly, for the present, more people will suffer and die, and humanity as we know it will look back on these days as dark days.

Principessa · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:35

Well Dave....You really said it there!

The United States is a great country and Europe has a lot to be thankful for, I realise that! Americans and Canadians gave their lives for us in both WW's. But, it's time for The United States to focus on their own country and inhabitants now! Poverty is rising in the United States, people get excluded from the society (ex: health insurance in US),...
Enough of playing cowboy in the Middle-East, enough of big talks about the use of nuclear weapons against North-Corea,....Get back to the things you did before: helping people and countries in need. Perhaps than many cruel events that colour our world history wouldn't have taken place: Genocide in Rwanda, war and genocide in the Balkan countries,......

Tom · Post 03 Mar 2006, 18:40

Sorry, but I feel I was slightly misquoted ther,

I reakon we can do something, Micheal Moore did, I've seen Bowling For Columbine, and recognised as a great piece of work, because it was so blunt.

If we try hard enough, there will be something we can do, some of the people on this sight are smarter than the F1 stratergists themselves.
(Take it as a compliment) We are a big group of people with the same interests, we are all friends on this site and together we can do much more than sit back and hope it goes away.

DaveKillens · Post 03 Mar 2006, 21:12

The American people are a strange, sometimes wonderful, but weird social experiment. Most are conditioned to be polarized in their thinking, in that they only see two solutions, without consideration for alternatives. This is typified in their political process, with the right wing Republicans at fierce odds with the left leaning Democrats. Neither side seems to understand that at times a middle ground compromise can solve a problem. At present, the Republicans with Mr Bush leading have hijacked this nation with a doctrine selling fear against "terrorists". Sadly, this has devolved into nothing but pathetic racism.
Mr Bush is in power because he sells fear from abroad, and his domestic policy has slipped into the background. Social progress is going backwards, personal liberties have been perverted into a fascist state. For instance, the "Patriot Act" (what a misnomer) gives authorities the power to place wiretaps and what used to be illegal surveilance on anyone if any suspicion or link can be invented that connects to terrorism. Just the suspicion can lead to being an enemy of the state. Where have we heard that before?
New Orleans was a graphic display of how negligent Mr Bush is in taking care of his own people. Oh, and as an astute political animal, he got away, he got someone to take the fall for him.
Personally, I don't believe in slamming Mr Bush, calling him foul names. That just pisses off the people you are trying to reach out to. I do however, disagree with about everything he is doing, and intends to do.

manchild · Post 09 Apr 2006, 18:32

Guess who said this:

"Our democracy is under attack; if we are to wage war on these foreign infiltrators, certain civil rights must be suspended"

Adolf Hitler, 1933

Ted68 · Post 10 Apr 2006, 07:17

My, oh my!

Where should I begin?

First off, New Orleans. Friends and neighbors to the North, don't believe all that you hear on T.V. What you are hearing now is the world's dim view of this administration wanting to put whatever possible on Bush's shoulders. Then again, he asked for it.

Be careful not to swallow it to easily. You are looking at too narrow of a slice of the problem, and without enough history to guide you.

It is both better and worse than you think.

For more than thirty years both federal and state governments have known that the flood protection around N.O. was woefully inadequate. That is long enough to indict any political party you wish; Left, right or independant. That would include Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush I, Clinton, and finally Bush II.

Now, for my foreign friends, the true party at fault here would be the State of Louisiana. They are the entity who is responsible for the infrastructure of the city of N.O. It is the State who is responsible for the welfare and safety of it's residents. The Federal Government is resposible for the welfare and safety of the Nation. Which is comprised of all fifty states together. As an example, 141 years ago, a few of the states decided they didn't like the Federal Gov and decided to start their own Confederate Government. There was some shooting, and we went back to a single Federal Gov. It should be in a book somewhere, look for it.

Point is, that it was the States acting independantly of the Fed. Which is how things work here.

Now, for the FEMA story, we have a Perfect Political Storm here. Thirty years of Louisiana politicians leaving the big problem of the fishbowl of NO to the next guy to deal with. Napolean knew it was below sea level when he sold it. It wasn't a new problem. Just one nobody in a very poor and corrupt state wanted to pay for.

Ted68

DaveKillens · Post 10 Apr 2006, 15:41

True ted, this flooding was inevitable. But it's the federal government's responsibility in all nations to step in when an overwhelming disaster occurs, because the local infrasctucture has been taxed beyond it's capacity.
Up here in Canada, we had immediatly sent teams of dedicated professional search and rescue experts, from east coast to west. That was the morning after, while the Bush administration was definitely dragging it's feet, playing some pathetic "we're waiting for you to call us for help" excuse. Meanwhile almost all our experts were turned away at the border because they were paramilitary, and Homeland Security had a case of the gollywobbles.
I think the point is that on the morning after, the entire world was aware of the plight of thousands in that devastated area, while the Bush administration say back on their haunches.

RH1300S · Post 10 Apr 2006, 16:29

DaveKillens wrote:The American people are a strange, sometimes wonderful, but weird social experiment

With respectful apologies to any Americans here.............

That's the best thing I've heard all year.........

A keeper

jgredline · Post 10 Apr 2006, 16:29

Ted68 wrote:My, oh my!

Where should I begin?

First off, New Orleans. Friends and neighbors to the North, don't believe all that you hear on T.V. What you are hearing now is the world's dim view of this administration wanting to put whatever possible on Bush's shoulders. Then again, he asked for it.

Be careful not to swallow it to easily. You are looking at too narrow of a slice of the problem, and without enough history to guide you.

It is both better and worse than you think.

For more than thirty years both federal and state governments have known that the flood protection around N.O. was woefully inadequate. That is long enough to indict any political party you wish; Left, right or independant. That would include Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush I, Clinton, and finally Bush II.

Now, for my foreign friends, the true party at fault here would be the State of Louisiana. They are the entity who is responsible for the infrastructure of the city of N.O. It is the State who is responsible for the welfare and safety of it's residents. The Federal Government is resposible for the welfare and safety of the Nation. Which is comprised of all fifty states together. As an example, 141 years ago, a few of the states decided they didn't like the Federal Gov and decided to start their own Confederate Government. There was some shooting, and we went back to a single Federal Gov. It should be in a book somewhere, look for it.

Point is, that it was the States acting independantly of the Fed. Which is how things work here.

Now, for the FEMA story, we have a Perfect Political Storm here. Thirty years of Louisiana politicians leaving the big problem of the fishbowl of NO to the next guy to deal with. Napolean knew it was below sea level when he sold it. It wasn't a new problem. Just one nobody in a very poor and corrupt state wanted to pay for.

Ted68

Ted
I agree with you 100%. This was a problem that was going to happen sooner or later and it would not have mattered what political group was in office. The fact of the matter is this. It was the Governers JOB to take care of her state. The National Gaurd was ready to go the day before and she denied them away!!!. She is the one along with the Mayor who decided they could handle it. This was not the Presidents JOB. In fact sometimes the very things that make the United States of America the greatest country in the world are the same things that can sometimes hurt, how ever it is the land of the free. On a second note, Thank GOD for Samaritans purse, The Salvation Army, the Red Cross and the many true Faith based organizations that are still still there to this day. In fact my church sent down a group of men to help rebuild N.O.
Funny, I didn't see the Red Crecent down there.
Thank GOD again for the internet (and AL GORE did not invent it as he claims) that if people really wanted to know the truth about what is going on its easu to find. As for the regular news, on FOX is fair.
Well I am now off my soap box.

Tom · Post 10 Apr 2006, 17:47

Before I came to upon this sight I didn't think much of Americans.

They all seemed to be war crazy children who never took responsibility for their actions, then I read the comments of people like Ted and jgredline and I realised that its only their leaders who are like that.

Therefore there is only one answer:

TED MUST RUN FOR PRESIDENT!

Ok joking aside, although I whole-heartedly agree with DaveKillens comments re social experiments, I mean it to be taken in the nicest way possible, because I also realised that you people can laugh at yourselves, and if you can't laugh at yourself, youve only got Bush.

jgredline · Post 10 Apr 2006, 18:22

Tom wrote:Before I came to upon this sight I didn't think much of Americans.

They all seemed to be war crazy children who never took responsibility for their actions, then I read the comments of people like Ted and jgredline and I realised that its only their leaders who are like that.

Therefore there is only one answer:

TED MUST RUN FOR PRESIDENT!

Ok joking aside, although I whole-heartedly agree with DaveKillens comments re social experiments, I mean it to be taken in the nicest way possible, because I also realised that you people can laugh at yourselves, and if you can't laugh at yourself, youve only got Bush.

Dave and Tom
Explain what is a social experiment for all of us AMERICANS on this forum?
I would like to know.