Petition to FIA - 2026 rules canceled, V10s in 2028

[CHT]

which mean F1 is lagging Formula E..?

Being 'green' isn't the only concern of F1 or its manufacturers, quite obviously. There's still a desire for it to be the fastest name in the game. And there's just no way to achieve that with full electric power while having 300km races at 5-6km tracks and all that.

But it's still a big enough concern for the sport in terms of attracting new entrants and engine manufacturers that it cant be ignored.

Battery technology are still being developed as we speak and they are becoming more power and compact.
If FIA, for the sake of "road car relevance" and "green" decide to switch to full electric F1, I am sure that is possible for battery to last a full race distant, as manufacturers will pour is huge resources to compete on batteries development and technology. Which I am sure will have more relevance to road car that existing expensive V6 hybrid. How many road car today has such technology btw? I know AMG has them, but they are hypercar or supercar which are of no relevance to mass market automotive industry due to cost.

[Seanspeed]

which mean F1 is lagging Formula E..?

Being 'green' isn't the only concern of F1 or its manufacturers, quite obviously. There's still a desire for it to be the fastest name in the game. And there's just no way to achieve that with full electric power while having 300km races at 5-6km tracks and all that.

But it's still a big enough concern for the sport in terms of attracting new entrants and engine manufacturers that it cant be ignored.

Battery technology are still being developed as we speak and they are becoming more power and compact.
If FIA, for the sake of "road car relevance" and "green" decide to switch to full electric F1, I am sure that is possible as manufacturers will pour is huge resources to compete on batteries development and technology. Which I am sure will have more relevance to road car that existing expensive V6 hybrid. How many road car today has such technology btw? I know AMG has them, but they are hypercar or supercar which are of no relevance to mass market automotive industry due to cost.

For a lot of the ICE era, F1 was a legit innovating force for advancements in power and efficiency.

But I dont think the same can be argued for electric batteries. It's certainly an additional impetus, but we've had extremely strong motivations to improve battery technologies regardless of electric cars for quite a while now.

And worse, it doesn't matter how much impetus there is, magical battery technology remains the realm of overhyped startups who end up in Chapter 11/7 before too long(or giant megacorps that have enough other endeavors that people forget about their failures). Chemical and material sciences certainly still have room for better batteries, but ones that are practical on a huge scale tend to be very much in the realm of 'minor evolutions' rather than all the magic utopian claims that you'll often read about.

I dont think F1 can really move the needle enough to justify some full electric move anytime in the foreseeable future.

[CHT]

I think the red herring here is that F1 engine technology need to be road car relevance. In the last 30 to 40 years how many F1 engine design actually end up on "road car"? The recent one I know is Mercedes-AMG ONE with a modified Formula 1-derived 1.6-liter V6 turbocharged engine, paired with four electric motors, and that cost a whopping US$2.7m each. Or the high revving Lexus LFA V10 which cost around US$400,000 when it was launched. How are they even consider as "road car" and how are they even relevant to F1 fans? I bet most people don't even get to see them on the road before.

[WardenOfTheNorth]

Wait for it...

It is ridiculous, arguing for noise.

I actually found it refreshing in 2014 when I first heard F1 cars' tires screeching or hearing the cars bottoming out, scraping the tarmac. It's as if someone unmuted those things.

It is ridiculous, arguing for noise.

Bravo.

Percentages were not in a vacuum, they were based on EV cars compared to equivalent ICE cars.

Which you offered because you, the EVismist, don't understand how an electric motors work, and later conflated a motor with an entire vehicle as though this helps your efforts here. But it was fun to see the Facts and Science guy get incensed over a true statement such as, "electric motors do not convert chemical energy into kinetic energy." Of all the forums, of all the threads, to feel capable of posting in... you choose these, lol.

Of all the things to find a sense of piety in your life about, you two chose... electronics.

Go on then. Prove me wrong. Prove that an ICE is more efficient somehow than an electric motor. That an ICE powered car is somehow more efficient efficient than an equivalent EV car.

Because you haven’t done that so far.

And arguing for more noise is arguing for less efficiency because noise is wasted energy.

[WardenOfTheNorth]

In YOUR opinion. My participation comes from working trackside at Silverstone. The current F1 cars are loud but not too loud and have a throaty bass and midrange not conveyed on TV as well as a complex sound with more than just the basic ICE sounds you get from other configurations.

Compared to historic F1 cars that are too loud with an ear piercingly high pitched scream that requires hearing protection even inside buildings next to the track.

Of course that is all in MY opinion.

Neither is right, neither is wrong and both are valid.

But you cannot surely tell me that the sound on TV is the same as in person, because that is empirically not the case.

You keep thinking this is an argument of my opinion vs your opinion.

I'm saying that my opinion is going to be so widely and obviously way more popular than yours among F1 fans. And of more casual fans that simply care less about it, again, they aren't going to be upset if the cars get louder and more visceral sounding.

I cant stress enough how much the loud, impressive sounding cars at Goodwood are what put smiles on people's faces there. And it's not like it's some unique era I'm referring to - basically any era of F1 had way better sounding engines than these modern ones. These current hybrid V6's are just, in a relative sense, supremely disappointing.

Unless you have any surveys to prove your claim then it IS your opinion vs my opinion.

Using Goodwood as your sample is introducing massive bias. Though I also saw how popular the hyper EV cars were there on social media…..not saying more than ICE cars, but pretty level….