2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Sevach
Sevach
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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GoranF1 wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 18:36

In Q ok....it seems that Honda is a little better in quali, but did you watch the race? All of those guys overtake Alonso whit no problem. Alonso said after the race something that makes it quite clear he is staying but Honda not.

BTW there was no problem whit the car he just drove in the pits very angry.
The problem is, you can't overtake in the infield, you can't even follow closely in the infield.
So Alonso gets eaten alive in the Kemmel Straight > Is limited by the car ahead of him through sector 2 > car behind closes the gap in S3 > Alonso gets eaten alive in the Kemmel Straight... rinse and repeat.


Hasegawa is saying that no problem was detected in Alonso's engine.
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2017/08/27/n ... say-honda/

Alonso says he did have a problem.
http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2017/08/27/a ... althy-car/

His radio about Vandoorne is f... hilarious :mrgreen:
Last edited by Sevach on 28 Aug 2017, 01:30, edited 1 time in total.

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loner
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Sevach wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 00:42


Hasegawa is saying that no problem was detected in Alonso's engine.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2017/08/27/n ... say-honda/
i have nothing to do with ALO but i think his rant is something healthy it means he still got it
and those are huge corporations they are not playing poker i mean they knew very well what would happen in the race
ALO knew it before the race.
i was waiting for the spec 4 in SPA thats one off i fully expect spec 4 to eliminate every team but the top 3 will it debut in MONZA ? would be great.
lets see the last upgrade when will debut coz i fully expect Mclaren Honda to be on bar with Redbull before the season end.
para bellum.

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MotoManiac
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Insisting on Alonso to be hired by Mclaren has to be one of the countless f***ups Honda has committed since they have been in F1. They knew he has volatile character, his previous stints at McLaren and Ferrari showed he can be frustrating to work with. How on earth Honda thought he would be pleased with their below par engines? Now they have a guy who is banking 40mil a year of their money and refusing to race and badmouths them in the media 24x7.

One thing for sure, we will be getting more "engine problems" in the next few races.

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RS200E
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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GoranF1 wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 23:42
Sayeman wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 23:39
GoranF1 wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 23:24
At the end of this interview it is quite clear that Zak Brown wants the same thing as Alonso and says once that is done, Alonso will stay.

Knowing that Mercedes , Ferrari and Renault have chickened out giving their PU to one of the best chassis on the grid, how possible it is that. secretly Cosworth who Zak is conected to will suply Mclaren whit PU?
Also Zak and Eric were seen in Porsche garage in LeMans, is it to late for those 2 options?
Or is Torro Roso switch of PU only real option?

https://youtu.be/xJ4-DnBGa-Y
Mclaren and Alonso have been bigging up their chassis so much that no manufacturer wants to supply them with PU.

Also only Porche? i thought at least 63 car manufacturers submitted application to Mr. Boulier to supply Mclaren with PUs?
If you watched that interview you know Honda will not suply Mclaren....who will i dont know but someone will.
No nothing like that can be taken from that interview. Not sure what you specifically heard that made you so sure about it.
The power of Red Bull Powertrains!

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RS200E
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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kfrantzios wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 00:07
GoranF1 wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 00:00
kfrantzios wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 23:59


So, how are they going to break the contract?
Performance clause
Let's see. If spec 4 is a failure and there is a performance clause in the contract, then an engine manufacturer will be forced to supply engines to Mclaren by regulations.
Sad to say but spec 4 can only be a failure in the over all sense. They will not gain enough power from now to spec 4.
The power of Red Bull Powertrains!

GhostF1
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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RS200E wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 01:45
kfrantzios wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 00:07
GoranF1 wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 00:00


Performance clause
Let's see. If spec 4 is a failure and there is a performance clause in the contract, then an engine manufacturer will be forced to supply engines to Mclaren by regulations.
Sad to say but spec 4 can only be a failure in the over all sense. They will not gain enough power from now to spec 4.
I agree with this. I cannot see Spec 4 being the holy grail engine, probably a mild improvement but that's about it. Looking at what happened to Max and Jolyon thoguh, it shouldn't give anyone confidence Renault will help them either. 50% completion rate for Max so far...

I think when Alonso said "we will see what evolves in the next couple of weeks" is not a hint that a divorce is certain and about to be announced, but more a hint McLaren have given Honda a final chance for the Spec 4 engine to show they can bring something to the table. Maybe that's also why they chose not to debut that at Spa, instead saying they couldn't meet the schedule, maybe they were wanting more time to get it right with this directive from McLaren.

It's all guesses right now, cards are being held very close to their chests.
I will say I'm definitely on the Ilmor consultancy bandwagon now though.. When they asked Zak about his thoughts on them working with Honda, he said he has no idea who Honda are working with (that's absolute rubbish, he probably knows what each executive had for breakfast). But he proceeded to talk extremely highly of Ilmor and that it would be good news if that were the case. Not going to get a more subtle confirmation than that.

DrDejan
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Hello, long time reader, first time poster.

First, many thanks to everyone on the forum. I enjoy your discussions, technical insights and "insider" stories.

I understand the team efforts to improve the car, aero, chassis and engine, and I don't have high expectations. But, when I saw Spa's qualifying and the first 5 laps, I was motivated to register and write the first post.

There's huge discrepancy between the relative aero/chassis performances and the relative engine performance. It's amazing how much of a miscommunication there is between those teams. Moreover, I'm very surprised with the quality of information originating from the engine side. It was evident during the testing, ahead of the season, and it continues to be since then. I was expecting the team to learn from the testing debacle, regroup, and develop the car in unisone.

As a japanese project management alumni, I'm dissapointed with the Honda F1 team management. I cannot fathom the level of miscommunication and planning, and the failure to deliver the promised milestones. Knowing the japanese culture and the knowledge they have, I expect changes in the management very soon.

On the other hand, I'm very dissapointed with the McLaren F1 team senior management, who are failing to maintain the image of the team, contain the dissatisfaction, and focus on productive improvements. They should keep the team members on a short leash, including Alonso, stay professional even in times on adversity, and work quietly in the background to improve the situation.

I hope everything will change when we get more engine performance from Honda, but as we can see from the Red Bull example, problems will not go away. So, be transparent to your partners, explain the problems in respectable manner, make improvement plan together and deliver as promissed.

Until then, let's enjoy Alonso's passes at Spa :-)

ecodelta
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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After what I have seen yesterday during the race, I think Mclaren will not longer use Honda enginers in 2018, no matter if Alonso remains or not in the team.

If Honda remains and Alonso leaves, can you imagine the race results Mclaer would get with an engine with such power deficit?

Mclaren with any other of the engines: mercedes, ferrari or renault, would at least be getting decent race result. With Honda, I don't see that in the near future.... unless miracle happens.

Sorry to see Honda failing so dismally, I didn't expect such terrible performance.

I cross my finger for Monza, but after what I have seen...... I have no hope at all.

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Andres125sx
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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HPD wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 16:51
I like Alonso, but he's still an employee. You must learn to respect your team.
In my country, if you speak ill of your boss ... then you will be fired.
In my country (wich is the same as Alonso) we fire those who can´t accomplish their own promises, in this case, Honda #-o

Showing frustration when promises are broken is considered normal around here. Not there? :roll:
Last edited by Andres125sx on 28 Aug 2017, 11:31, edited 1 time in total.

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Andres125sx
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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GoranF1 wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 18:36
In Q ok....it seems that Honda is a little better in quali, but did you watch the race? All of those guys overtake Alonso whit no problem. Alonso said after the race something that makes it quite clear he is staying but Honda not.

BTW there was no problem whit the car he just drove in the pits very angry.
So you were expecting a different thing at Spa Francochamps? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Please, stop bashing Alonso, there was a problem, the team called him to pits, people on track noticed a weird PU noise.... please stop the BS

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Thunder
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Also his Boss is Zak Brown, not Mr. Hasegawa.
turbof1 wrote: YOU SHALL NOT......STALLLLL!!!
#aerogollum

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MotoManiac
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Andres125sx wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 11:26
GoranF1 wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 18:36
In Q ok....it seems that Honda is a little better in quali, but did you watch the race? All of those guys overtake Alonso whit no problem. Alonso said after the race something that makes it quite clear he is staying but Honda not.

BTW there was no problem whit the car he just drove in the pits very angry.
So you were expecting a different thing at Spa Francochamps? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Please, stop bashing Alonso, there was a problem, the team called him to pits, people on track noticed a weird PU noise.... please stop the BS
Please stop defending Alonso like he is saint joseph and can do no wrong. Noone is beyond scrutiny. I remember he got heavily rebuked by Montezemelo when be suggested he would rather have a redbull over a Ferrari, that's humiliating for a company like Ferrari. Noone remembers how he blackmailed Mclaren and Dennis? Forcing Dennis to run to FIA, the petulance doesn't stop there. Alonso and de la Rosa (the test driver) had been exchanging emails about secret Ferrari data before even Dennis knew about it.This is a guy who's not afraid to get his hands dirty to get what he wants. Lets stop treating him like he is the epitome of professionalism.

How is retiring the car intentionally helping the team? It's not like he's been whining this year, he's been whining since 2015.As Lauda says, Alonso went to Mclaren for money and now suffering for it. And there was no problem with the engine, as Hasegawa said afterwards.

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diffuser
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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If ALO retired the car early, it isn't a problem it is a symptom. Just like when you have a cold you sneeze. The problem is the PU needs to be more competitive.

BTW, He didn't go to McLaren for the money, Ferrari was offering him the same amount of money and a longer contract.

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Andres125sx
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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MotoManiac wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 12:45
Andres125sx wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 11:26
GoranF1 wrote:
27 Aug 2017, 18:36
In Q ok....it seems that Honda is a little better in quali, but did you watch the race? All of those guys overtake Alonso whit no problem. Alonso said after the race something that makes it quite clear he is staying but Honda not.

BTW there was no problem whit the car he just drove in the pits very angry.
So you were expecting a different thing at Spa Francochamps? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Please, stop bashing Alonso, there was a problem, the team called him to pits, people on track noticed a weird PU noise.... please stop the BS
Please stop defending Alonso like he is saint joseph and can do no wrong.
So he can only be a Saint or a poor professional? :roll:

Sorry but I´m not that extremist

MotoManiac wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 12:45
I remember he got heavily rebuked by Montezemelo when be suggested he would rather have a redbull over a Ferrari, that's humiliating for a company like Ferrari.
Agree, it was humilliating for a company who think they´re the best, but can´t reach expectations. Not Alonso´s fault tough, he could be a lot more polite, agree on that, but not being polite is VERY different to not being a proffesional. Top proffesionals are demanding, always, or they wouldn´t be on top.

MotoManiac wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 12:45
Noone remembers how he blackmailed Mclaren and Dennis?
What none remembers is he was found innocent. It was McLaren who received a severe penalty, as it was McLaren who could take advantage of that info, not drivers.
MotoManiac wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 12:45
This is a guy who's not afraid to get his hands dirty to get what he wants. Lets stop treating him like he is the epitome of professionalism.

How is retiring the car intentionally helping the team?
Let´s invent some absurd theory, to then use that theory as an evidence of his egolatry... :roll:

MotoManiac wrote:
28 Aug 2017, 12:45
Lauda says, Alonso went to Mclaren for money and now suffering for it.
Lauda says so much BS... If Alonso went to McLaren for money he wouldn´t be considering retiring if Honda does not become competitive. He´d be glad to drive wichever car they provide to him if they keep paying his salary. Honda pays Alonso salary, do you think the constant whinning you´re refering to is what anyone who only cares about money would do with the company who pay his salary?

Absurd, plain and simple.

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Sayeman
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Re: 2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

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Auto motor und sport says, Mclaren is looking to solicit 200 million from Honda after their divorce and Honda doesn't want to pay it, wants to continue in F1 and has made that clear to the FIA.
Never Give up.