2026 Mercedes-AMG Petronas F1 Team

[upsidedowntoast]

Well, certainly not the best chassis because that’s the Ferrari. We’ve come to a point in F1 where the best chassis gets beaten by well over half a second in qualifying.

I wish there was a way to run the car by removing the PU and with "chassis only". It would be so much fun to see how Lewis and Charles would dominate F1. I would bet on Charles winning that contest still, while poor Mercedes might not even come out of garage.

"Aerodynamics is for people who can't build engines." -- Enzo Ferrari

my my how the turn tables

Instead of quoting Enzo from the 1960s you should live in the present.

Modern F1 has primarily been about downforce and cornering performance for decades now. FIA turning the formula into a PU formula and <mod edit: spam removed> does not change this fact.

It’s a farce that Ferrari is over 6 tenths faster than Mercedes in the corners, but loses 9 tenths on the straights because Toto Wolff is a good politician and a buddy of Ben Sulayem.

Are we going to repeat the illegal engine line to the end of time like the "stolen election" rallying cry? It's been tested at higher temperature and it still passed. We'll see if anything changes come June.

You can't just decide aerodynamics are the only thing that matters just because you happen to be better at aero but worse at engine today; that's not how this works. Both are needed for a car to function.

F1 has not just been about cornering and downforce. The last few years have been because of the engine freeze but before that Ferrari was developing strong engines too.

[Tonino]

Beating Ferrari just feels different. Winning over Red Bull is great, sure but beating Ferrari? Nothing comes close to it. Feels almost orgasmic

Best part? We’re not even pushing the car yet, and then comes the usual “illegal engine” crying, which just makes it even sweeter

[GrizzleBoy]

Wholesomeness from Toto re: his chick that flew the nest


Followed by all encompassing destruction and fire from the W17:

[LM10]

It’s a farce that Ferrari is over 6 tenths faster than Mercedes in the corners, but loses 9 tenths on the straights because Toto Wolff is a good politician and a buddy of Ben Sulayem.

"Over 6 tenths faster in the corners, because F1 podcast overlay said so"

https://i.postimg.cc/qBmMKg3x/Kepkivaga ... verlay.png

In the sprint, George and Kimi were riding the dirty air and scrubbing the Prancing Horses' gearboxes pretty well enough for having cars >6 tenths slower in the corners, wouldn't you say?

... by the way, so far, Mercedes has been faster on pretty much all straights this season (when arriving with "regular" deployment strategy), now, we can't infer drag levels from top speeds anymore for obvious reasons, but you are kind of just granting your favourite team that ANY straight line deficit they have must purely be from PU deficit, and none from excess drag...

Didn’t see the telemetry was the comparison of the fastest laps of both. Apologies for that.

As for the interpretation of it, Ferrari has in all but one corner higher apex speeds. I don’t know what exactly F1’s methodology was to say Ferrari was 6 tenths faster in the corners, but why would they lie?
Mercedes’s acceleration was significantly better than Ferrari’s and the deltas in the telemetry you’ve shown include the acceleration too.

[upsidedowntoast]

This might be a dumb question but could the difference in cornering speed be a sacrifice to end up with more battery for the straights? i.e. it's a decision made in tandem with developing their recharge strategy, kind of like how Ferrari sacrificed a larger turbo for better starts.

[nitrotech]

This might be a dumb question but could the difference in cornering speed be a sacrifice to end up with more battery for the straights? i.e. it's a decision made in tandem with developing their recharge strategy, kind of like how Ferrari sacrificed a larger turbo for better starts.

It definitely is the case. I saw that from the testing itself. You need more battery power, compromise corner speeds (entry to mid) and then use the battery to shoot out of corners with great speeds. Build a good mechanical platform that allows great exit without too much wheel spin. Having high consistent downforce (which you cannot stall in straights) is now detriment to that approach as it causes drag. It's not that Mercedes cannot attack the corners and compete with Ferrari for being faster through corners, it's just not efficient anymore. Ferrari is killing it's tyres in trying to escape away from Mercedes after those shooting starts. That would be an achilles heel. I also heard on F1TV that the gearing ratio is also something that Mercedes has managed to keep in harmony with the power output. It's now locked for the year. So even if Ferrari comes up with some upgrades in PU, not sure how harmonious it would be with gearing ratios. That seems to be something affecting McLaren currently. So there are so many parameters that Mercedes has figured out better than others. It's interesting to see how the development race goes from hereon. So this great chassis great chassis thing is just nonsense.

Words from Leclerc that aligns with attacking corners.

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/1091382/1 ... 26-f1-cars

Leclerc conceded that he’s had to change his approach: “They are very strange in qualifying, because I felt like in the past one of my strengths coming into Q3, I was just taking massive risks to get something out more.

“And, now when you do that, which I did yesterday, you start confusing the engine side of things, and you start losing a lot more than what you gain.

“So consistency pays off more, and today I felt like I just found my rhythm from Q1 to Q3, which is a bit less exciting for Q3 when you are in the car, because you can’t push like you want.

“At the end of the day it paid off because I’m closer to the guys in front. But it was not a crazy lap, unfortunately, but you cannot really achieve that anymore, I think.”

[zibby43]

Beating Ferrari just feels different. Winning over Red Bull is great, sure but beating Ferrari? Nothing comes close to it. Feels almost orgasmic

Best part? We’re not even pushing the car yet, and then comes the usual “illegal engine” crying, which just makes it even sweeter

Well said. As soon as I wake up in the AM and my brain remembers we’re mud-stomping the Scuderia, I jump straight out of bed with a pep in my step.

The illegal engine cries only make it more satisfying.

[hollus]

Hold it with the Schadenfreude, guys. You would not tolerate it in the opposite direction. Trolling will get warnings.

[OverheatedTurbo]

Hold it with the Schdenfreude, guys. You would not tolerate it in the opposite direction. Trolling will get warnings.

Missed the chance to use Achtung in that statement

[OverheatedTurbo]

This might be a dumb question but could the difference in cornering speed be a sacrifice to end up with more battery for the straights? i.e. it's a decision made in tandem with developing their recharge strategy, kind of like how Ferrari sacrificed a larger turbo for better starts.

It definitely is the case. I saw that from the testing itself. You need more battery power, compromise corner speeds (entry to mid) and then use the battery to shoot out of corners with great speeds. Build a good mechanical platform that allows great exit without too much wheel spin. Having high consistent downforce (which you cannot stall in straights) is now detriment to that approach as it causes drag. It's not that Mercedes cannot attack the corners and compete with Ferrari for being faster through corners, it's just not efficient anymore. Ferrari is killing it's tyres in trying to escape away from Mercedes after those shooting starts. That would be an achilles heel. I also heard on F1TV that the gearing ratio is also something that Mercedes has managed to keep in harmony with the power output. It's now locked for the year. So even if Ferrari comes up with some upgrades in PU, not sure how harmonious it would be with gearing ratios. That seems to be something affecting McLaren currently. So there are so many parameters that Mercedes has figured out better than others. It's interesting to see how the development race goes from hereon. So this great chassis great chassis thing is just nonsense.

Words from Leclerc that aligns with attacking corners.

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/1091382/1 ... 26-f1-cars

Leclerc conceded that he’s had to change his approach: “They are very strange in qualifying, because I felt like in the past one of my strengths coming into Q3, I was just taking massive risks to get something out more.

“And, now when you do that, which I did yesterday, you start confusing the engine side of things, and you start losing a lot more than what you gain.

“So consistency pays off more, and today I felt like I just found my rhythm from Q1 to Q3, which is a bit less exciting for Q3 when you are in the car, because you can’t push like you want.

“At the end of the day it paid off because I’m closer to the guys in front. But it was not a crazy lap, unfortunately, but you cannot really achieve that anymore, I think.”

This actually makes a lot of sense.

[upsidedowntoast]

This might be a dumb question but could the difference in cornering speed be a sacrifice to end up with more battery for the straights? i.e. it's a decision made in tandem with developing their recharge strategy, kind of like how Ferrari sacrificed a larger turbo for better starts.

It definitely is the case. I saw that from the testing itself. You need more battery power, compromise corner speeds (entry to mid) and then use the battery to shoot out of corners with great speeds. Build a good mechanical platform that allows great exit without too much wheel spin. Having high consistent downforce (which you cannot stall in straights) is now detriment to that approach as it causes drag. It's not that Mercedes cannot attack the corners and compete with Ferrari for being faster through corners, it's just not efficient anymore. Ferrari is killing it's tyres in trying to escape away from Mercedes after those shooting starts. That would be an achilles heel. I also heard on F1TV that the gearing ratio is also something that Mercedes has managed to keep in harmony with the power output. It's now locked for the year. So even if Ferrari comes up with some upgrades in PU, not sure how harmonious it would be with gearing ratios. That seems to be something affecting McLaren currently. So there are so many parameters that Mercedes has figured out better than others. It's interesting to see how the development race goes from hereon. So this great chassis great chassis thing is just nonsense.

Yeah this is all so confusing, not going to lie. Historically cornering ability was the mark of a good chassis which is why everyone is saying Ferrari has the best aero right now but the more I think about it the more I wonder if Mercedes has the optimal aero *for this regset* because corners are no longer so important. (Which sucks for what we classically think about racing but...whatever.)

This video agrees with you: https://youtu.be/jh7zo4EW9MI?si=Q07iedn28dl0JbHH Mercedes is probably having lower tyre deg at the China track because of how slower they are through the corners compared to Ferrari.

i.e. The speed they gain on the straights is not solely due to PU, it's also how they've chosen to lay out their aero to work with that PU. Traditionally we had a corner/tyre tradeoff choice, now it's corner/(tyre+charging) tradeoff which is a much easier sacrifice.

Beating Ferrari just feels different. Winning over Red Bull is great, sure but beating Ferrari? Nothing comes close to it. Feels almost orgasmic

Best part? We’re not even pushing the car yet, and then comes the usual “illegal engine” crying, which just makes it even sweeter

Well said. As soon as I wake up in the AM and my brain remembers we’re mud-stomping the Scuderia, I jump straight out of bed with a pep in my step.

The illegal engine cries only make it more satisfying.

It is literally not even the second race yet, chill. Everyone thought Ferrari would run away with it at the start of 2022 as well. In-season development is a thing.

[Matt2725]

I think this "illegal PU" is being pushed way too much now. It's frustrating that Mercedes got this advantage right now, but they just pushed things to the limit of what they thought was allowed. It's the name of the game. There was a gray area and they exploited the sh*t out of it. Blame it on the FIA for presumably being in continuous contact with Mercedes during development and allowing it to happen.

It's obviously annoying for those who played the game completely by the book, but try to see it from the other perspective as well. If you allow them to dump resources during development and then come out later and say "you know what we just changed our mind", is not fair either. You have to be consistent all the way through and the FIA f*cked up when they gave Mercedes the green light to continue in this path.

It sucks but it is the way it is. No need to keep pushing this "illegal PU" agenda all the time.

Nobody cares about their opinion anyway. The PU is not illegal, it’s just that they can’t build an engine to save their lives.

Indeed. I've seen comments after a picture emerged of Checo's Ferrari engine after the sprint thanks to the cover flying off. Comments suggested that an ex-Merc engineer commented that the packaging of the engine in general was really poor.

This might be a dumb question but could the difference in cornering speed be a sacrifice to end up with more battery for the straights? i.e. it's a decision made in tandem with developing their recharge strategy, kind of like how Ferrari sacrificed a larger turbo for better starts.

That's exactly what's going on. George is sacrificing a lot of speed through T11 for more battery down the back straight this weekend. It's often why he's been finding 2-3 tenths or more than Kimi can do. You'll note Kimi is always purple is S2 vs Russell who is often up to a tenth slower for that very reason. He's sacrificing corner performance for more straight line later on.

[WardenOfTheNorth]

This might be a dumb question but could the difference in cornering speed be a sacrifice to end up with more battery for the straights? i.e. it's a decision made in tandem with developing their recharge strategy, kind of like how Ferrari sacrificed a larger turbo for better starts.

It definitely is the case. I saw that from the testing itself. You need more battery power, compromise corner speeds (entry to mid) and then use the battery to shoot out of corners with great speeds. Build a good mechanical platform that allows great exit without too much wheel spin. Having high consistent downforce (which you cannot stall in straights) is now detriment to that approach as it causes drag. It's not that Mercedes cannot attack the corners and compete with Ferrari for being faster through corners, it's just not efficient anymore. Ferrari is killing it's tyres in trying to escape away from Mercedes after those shooting starts. That would be an achilles heel. I also heard on F1TV that the gearing ratio is also something that Mercedes has managed to keep in harmony with the power output. It's now locked for the year. So even if Ferrari comes up with some upgrades in PU, not sure how harmonious it would be with gearing ratios. That seems to be something affecting McLaren currently. So there are so many parameters that Mercedes has figured out better than others. It's interesting to see how the development race goes from hereon. So this great chassis great chassis thing is just nonsense.

Words from Leclerc that aligns with attacking corners.

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/1091382/1 ... 26-f1-cars

Leclerc conceded that he’s had to change his approach: “They are very strange in qualifying, because I felt like in the past one of my strengths coming into Q3, I was just taking massive risks to get something out more.

“And, now when you do that, which I did yesterday, you start confusing the engine side of things, and you start losing a lot more than what you gain.

“So consistency pays off more, and today I felt like I just found my rhythm from Q1 to Q3, which is a bit less exciting for Q3 when you are in the car, because you can’t push like you want.

“At the end of the day it paid off because I’m closer to the guys in front. But it was not a crazy lap, unfortunately, but you cannot really achieve that anymore, I think.”

I thought they had the option to change gear ratios once during this season due to the change in regs?

[WardenOfTheNorth]

Well, certainly not the best chassis because that’s the Ferrari. We’ve come to a point in F1 where the best chassis gets beaten by well over half a second in qualifying.

Would you have the same opinion if Ferrari were the ones with a rocketship engine and mediocre chassis?

Hahahah, of course you wouldn't.

You mean the illegal engine which Mercedes is allowed to operate until June?

Please share the link to the tests it failed.

[MB_Racer]

Beating Ferrari just feels different. Winning over Red Bull is great, sure but beating Ferrari? Nothing comes close to it. Feels almost orgasmic

Best part? We’re not even pushing the car yet, and then comes the usual “illegal engine” crying, which just makes it even sweeter

Fully agreed you described all very well!!