Bears & woods

[ringo]

I think we're back at looking on little tricks that red bull are using to gain a huge advantage. the thing with aero is that small things can't make big differences. They only do so if they have very high energy. The elephant in the room is the big things on the car, such as the shape.
I think I've stated a couple years ago that they make their advantageous down force in the middle of the car by the splitter, mid body and gearbox area. I mentioned a basic 11% advantaged. This seemed to be scoffed at the time.
But they really do have a minimum of 11% down-force advantage.
It's in the side pod design, the splitter and gearbox area. Diffuser blowing has some part to play as well, and it seems to be more significant than last years, but most of the advantage is in the body and there's no reason why this wont continue next year.
We've seen that they can use as little rear wing as they desire, as their down force is well centralized.
The diffuser is another area, but I don't think quanity of downforce is the differentiator compared to other exhaust blown cars, as quality is. The raw advantage is in the basic shape that has been used for about 4 years now.

[henra]

the thing with aero is that small things can't make big differences. They only do so if they have very high energy. The elephant in the room is the big things on the car, such as the shape.

Yup. =D>

We've seen that they can use as little rear wing as they desire, as their down force is well centralized.
The diffuser is another area, but I don't think quanity of downforce is the differentiator compared to other exhaust blown cars, as quality is. The raw advantage is in the basic shape that has been used for about 4 years now.

Another yup.
Personally I tend to think it is the way they treat the air all the way to the diffuser and Beam wing including optimum packaging and internal streamlining to keep hot air exits as small as possible and far away from the flow to the diffuser. Anything that spoils that flow to the diffuser -be it underneath the waist of the car or above it- will cost downforce.
- Underneath by reducing air velocity thereby increasing static pressure and thus defeating down force.
- Above by reducing velocity over the diffuser exit and thereby reducing its flow velocity in the throat and thus its efficiency.

[raymondu999]

I think we're back at looking on little tricks that red bull are using to gain a huge advantage. the thing with aero is that small things can't make big differences. They only do so if they have very high energy. The elephant in the room is the big things on the car, such as the shape.
I think I've stated a couple years ago that they make their advantageous down force in the middle of the car by the splitter, mid body and gearbox area. I mentioned a basic 11% advantaged. This seemed to be scoffed at the time.
But they really do have a minimum of 11% down-force advantage.
It's in the side pod design, the splitter and gearbox area. Diffuser blowing has some part to play as well, and it seems to be more significant than last years, but most of the advantage is in the body and there's no reason why this wont continue next year.
We've seen that they can use as little rear wing as they desire, as their down force is well centralized.
The diffuser is another area, but I don't think quanity of downforce is the differentiator compared to other exhaust blown cars, as quality is. The raw advantage is in the basic shape that has been used for about 4 years now.

Yes. The number of ellipses is stunning.

[timbo]

I think we're back at looking on little tricks that red bull are using to gain a huge advantage. the thing with aero is that small things can't make big differences.

So how come they made a big jump in performance after Spa?
It's really small details which make a performance balance change within a field during the season.

[henra]

It's really small details which make a performance balance change within a field during the season.

Yes, but only if the potential is provided by the basic design of the car.
Regarding RB9 I have the feeling that besides some tweeks to unlock the potetial the bigger step in performance has to do with the tyres. It seems they don't have too conflicting setup requirements anymore between Quali and Race.
At the beginning of the Season one had the impression they could choose between good performance in Quali with too high degradation in the Race or average performance in Quali with acceptable degradation in the Race. Such effects can completely spoil the visible potential of a car.
I don't know if they have modified their geometry somewhere in between to complement the 'new' tyres.

[Richard]

So just to make sure I've understood this correctly .....

• A car that has wiped out the competition for the last 4 years has had good shape for the last 4 years?
• The details make a difference, but only if the basic shape is correct.
• The performance of the basic shape can only be unlocked by getting the details right
• Bears go to the toilet in the woods, but only if there are trees are in the woods in the first place.
• Trees that have elliptical bear poo deposited at the bottom grow 11.23781% taller than a tree with round poo. I'm unable to explain that because its a secret so please don't ask any questions about it.

[/i]