Female Drivers making the starting grid?

[KarenB111]

Hi,

I read today about Susie Wolff, the williams development driver.

http://theweeg.com/2014/03/08/lone-wolf ... -the-rise/

There seems to be a big fuss being made about her in the media as she is participating in one of the Friday sessions in the German grand prix. She still seems miles away from making it to the starting grid. Do you think we will have a woman competing in a championship in the next decade?

[NTS]

You can see it as a funnel, at the top everybody with serious ambitions in karting goes in and at the bottom only between 20 and 30 F1 drivers come out. The problem is that the last steps are extremely hard even for the most talented drivers, and require a combination of skill, but not in the last place connections and a lot of money.

If you look at how many female drivers are in the top of the funnel you'll realize quickly that the chances of having a female driver at the bottom of the funnel in the group of 22 actual F1 drivers are very slim. Not because female drivers have less talents, but mostly because there just are not that many female drivers.

[KarenB111]

Hmmm I agree with a lot of that.

Sticking with the example I gave, Susie Wolff, it seems like she is used sometimes as a marketing ploy. I'm not doubting her abilities just the amount of press she's been getting in the UK recently is very high for a development driver. But I'm happy she is doing what she's doing.

[Vettel Maggot]

Helps when you are a shareholders Mrs.. I'd rather see a young gun (male or female) get a go rather than an executives wife.

[marcush.]

No doubt a really talented female driver is your pr departments dream.so if there was a decent Girl around she had an Easy turn to get the Job. Bernie Said so 25 years ago .maybe now is the Time .i have the Feeling sauber will campaign a female driver Soon

[ChrisF1]

I don't keep up with the lower formula series - there are too many of them - so any of the more knowledgeable people think there are any potential female top level drivers (Not necessarily F1)

[Aesto]

Personally I think Beitske Visser probably has the best chances of making it to the grid. She was part of Red Bull junior team last year (but got dropped for 2014 along with most other people in it) and appears to be one of the few women who can actually compete purely on merit. She's only 18 though, so might still be a few years until she rises through the ranks (currently driving in Formula ADAC, tested F3.5 recently though).
https://twitter.com/beitskevisser

As far as Susie Wolff and Simone de Silvestro are concerned: Just look at their results in DTM and Indy Car, respectively. They are both terrible. Then again, Chilton also made it to the grid somehow, so I guess everything is possible :<

[MOWOG]

A most interesting thread, Karen. Thank you for starting it.

I think the first question is, can a woman compete at an equal level in motor racing with men? We don't see any women competing with men in soccer, football, baseball, lacrosse, basketball, tennis or curling. Why? I know Serena Williams could wipe the court with me if given half a chance. Are women just inherently unable to compete against men? Is there some organic reason why a woman should not be able to drive a car as fast as a man? Shirley Muldowney certainly knew how to peddle a dragster down a quarter mile track at a reasonably good pace!

I don't know the answers to these questions but would like to hear what others have to say.

I know a young woman locally who drove quite competitively in NASCAR North events. I even wrote an article about her for the local media. She started karting at 7 and moved up through the classes to the SK Modified ranks, but eventually gave it up because it got too expensive to move forward.

I like the concept of the funnel, which is consistent with most sports. It is an often cruel practice that requires enormous commitment of money and time to make your way through. I recall when Fernando Alonso first made it to Formula One, he quite candidly admitted that there were plenty of drivers in the lower ranks who were as good as him and some even better, but he got some breaks they did not via sponsorship and so forth that moved him forward while they remained behind.

I admit I have always been offended by Danica Patrick, who seems to have had trouble during her career deciding whether she wants to be a driver or a swim suit model. We don't see many male drivers selling Speedos and thongs. Why does Danica think she needs to buy in to the woman as sexual object paradigm?

I think as long as society views a woman as primarily a convenient receptacle for a man's lustful desires, the career path of most women will be far more difficult than for a man. Abstractly, I would like to see that attitude done away with. I would like to see a woman playing in major league baseball or on an NBA team. There are some women basketball players with electric talent on the court. I think seeing more women competing with men would go a long way toward changing people's minds about sexuality and sports.

But is the world really seeking such change? It's hard to overturn 50,000 years of biology.

Looking forward to more discussions in this thread.

[ChrisF1]

I believe a Swedish football team tried to register a female player a few years back and it was blocked by either their Football Association, UEFA or FIFA.

With the rise of Female sports it seems that people are happy to see them kept apart. Interestingly though, there is going to be a 1 day Womens Road Race that finishes on the Champs Elysee on the same day as the Tour De France this year.

Off topic, MOWOG - do I spy an A-Series?

[krisfx]

Alice Powell is now a BRDC rising star, she's currently racing in F3, has won the Formula Renault 3.5 championship and is the only female to score points in GP3 to date.

She's likely to maybe make it to GP3(Again) or GP2 in the next few years.

[SectorOne]

Alice Powell is now a BRDC rising star, she's currently racing in F3, has won the Formula Renault 3.5 championship

Psst, Renault 2.0 not 3.5

I´d say Simona de Silvestro seems closest to an actual racing seat. Wolff is too old now in my opinion.

[Andres125sx]

Do you think we will have a woman competing in a championship in the next decade?

To me the only question is who and when, but in the next decade? Sure

You can see it as a funnel, at the top everybody with serious ambitions in karting goes in and at the bottom only between 20 and 30 F1 drivers come out. The problem is that the last steps are extremely hard even for the most talented drivers...

This is what makes it more difficult, but not because women can´t do it, it´s just a matter of statistics, what´s the percentage of women who try to become a profesional driver? The percentage is quite low, so the chances of a woman who become a top driver are quite low too. It doesn´t matter if they´re more/less skilled than men, with such a low percentage of women interested in racing it would be a miracle

It´s the same as men from a country with no tradition in F1, for example China. Now we start seeing some chinese driver (HRT test driver was chinese) but there is so little interest for F1 in China it´s very difficult to see a chinese driver that can perform at top level.

Don´t know the number, but let´s say you need 100.000 drivers trying to reach the top to see one of them succeding... if there´s few people trying (women, chinese....) it will be difficult to see one of them at top level

...and require a combination of skill, but not in the last place connections and a lot of money.

And this is what, IMO, makes it doable.

There are so many men drivers than sponsoring a woman is a distinguishing factor that guarantee you a higher TV coverage, so for a sponsor it´s always better to support a woman than a equally skilled man

Same for the competition itself, a woman competing would increase the TV audience so even FIA will promote a woman, so the connections and money are not a problem for them I think

That´s the reason I´m sure we´ll see a woman in the next decade, they don´t need to be as skilled as a man to earn the neccessary support, what minimizes the problem of few women competing.

We´ve seen quite a lot of examples yet, with all my admiration for her, De Villota was not a better driver than some who have never had a chance. She was a good driver? Yes, She was one of the top 30-40 of the planet who deserve an opportunity? I don´t think so, but she had it because it brings a lot of attention for the team and competition, so everybody will be happy with a woman driving one of their cars if she has a minimum level

[Andres125sx]

A most interesting thread, Karen. Thank you for starting it.

I think the first question is, can a woman compete at an equal level in motor racing with men? We don't see any women competing with men in soccer, football, baseball, lacrosse, basketball, tennis or curling. Why? I know Serena Williams could wipe the court with me if given half a chance. Are women just inherently unable to compete against men? Is there some organic reason why a woman should not be able to drive a car as fast as a man? Shirley Muldowney certainly knew how to peddle a dragster down a quarter mile track at a reasonably good pace!

I don't know the answers to these questions but would like to hear what others have to say.

It depends on the importancy of strenght and corpulence. Can you imagine a woman defending Lebron James?

Physical differences are too high for some sports, specially those where there´s contact (basketball, football...) but I´m not sure about F1. They sure need a good resistance, but I´m not sure if the requirements are too high for a woman competing with men in equal conditions. I´d say no, but who knows until we see someone trying

[langwadt]

I believe a Swedish football team tried to register a female player a few years back and it was blocked by either their Football Association, UEFA or FIFA.

With the rise of Female sports it seems that people are happy to see them kept apart. Interestingly though, there is going to be a 1 day Womens Road Race that finishes on the Champs Elysee on the same day as the Tour De France this year.

I'm guessing their thinking is that if they allow women to play on mens team then they would have to allow men to play
on the womens team. When muscle strength is a factor women don't stand a chance, the worlds best female soccer team can't beat a team of 15 year old boys.

But I don't see why a women couldn't be competitive in F1, Michèle Mouton did quite well in rally

but since 1950 only about 800 has ever been in a grandprix, even if they were picked randomly there is a good chance
there wouldn't be a women

[Roland Ehnström]

Personally I think Beitske Visser probably has the best chances of making it to the grid. She was part of Red Bull junior team last year (but got dropped for 2014 along with most other people in it) and appears to be one of the few women who can actually compete purely on merit. She's only 18 though, so might still be a few years until she rises through the ranks (currently driving in Formula ADAC, tested F3.5 recently though).
https://twitter.com/beitskevisser

As far as Susie Wolff and Simone de Silvestro are concerned: Just look at their results in DTM and Indy Car, respectively. They are both terrible. Then again, Chilton also made it to the grid somehow, so I guess everything is possible :<

Well, de Silvestro is not terrible, far from it. I think she is the real deal. But agreed, Susie Wolff is not an F1-level talent. I did not know about Beitske Visser - will be interesting to follow her career!

Overall, I think female drivers have a slight genetic advantage in motorsports compared to men, simply in that they are generally shorter and lighter. Strength and stamina is not an issue - it's all about mental skill anyway. But as long as 99% of the Go-Kart drivers in the world are boys, 99% of the F1 drivers will be men, it's just statistics. But that number is changing slowly but surely - more and more girls are becoming interested in persuing a career in motorsports, so more and more women will eventually emerge in the top series such as NASCAR, IndyCar, WRC, DTM, and, yes, Formula 1. She may not be born yet, but I predict we'll see a female Formula 1 World Champion before the year 2050.