My Virtual F1 Car

[eidetic]

Hi all, I'd like to introduce myself and thank everyone for the wonderful discussions. I've been lurking for just a few weeks now off and on, but decided to sign up. Lots of really good discussions here, by some rather knowledgeable folks (or at least, as far as I can tell). Hopefully I'll be able to post a bit in the future, but it seems like most people have a better idea of what's going on than I do . As such, I thought this might be a good place to post my 3D modeled F1 car for some feedback and tips, critiques, etc.

I apologize that my first post is basically self promotion and asking for help, but hopefully I'll be able to become a valuable member to the forums one day, if I ever know what I'm talking about Also, I chekced the posting guidelines but saw nothing regarding image sizes, if the attached images are too big let me know and I'll resize them or use links.



Onto the goodies:

The car is basically my own creation, though I'll be borrowing heavily from design cues off other cars. This will be immediately noticable with the bodywork cooling in the following render (taken from the R25). I guess I'll be essentialyl taking cues from cars that I really like, and then adding my own twist, as well as creating my own parts from scratch. I'll probably also do quite a few variations on my design, especially when it comes to the wings, winglets, and suspension geometry.



As you can see, it's almost a blatant rip off of the R25, though I have sharpened the lines a bit when it comes to the raised cockpit structure.



Here's just a quick material test. I'll also be doing various liveries for the car, and high on my list are an orangish scheme like the McLaren testing livery, as well as green, and yellow. ( The return of Lotus to F1 maybe? )

Now for some interior bits of the car, and this is where I need help.








(sort of a pointless material test, as I generally hold off on texturing till all the modeling is done)

I mentioned I needed help, and any help you all can offer would be awesome and VERY MUCH appreciated. I'm basically looking for any high res images of the "interior" parts of the cars. Photos such as maybe the car int eh garage, being worked on, with the engine cover off. Or the nose cone of. Or just about any bodywork removed, exposing the engine, radiator, fuel tank, suspension, brakes, etc. (Drawings would also be beneficial, but I'm guessing they'd be harder to come by than photos. If you have anything you can help offer, a response in this thread (so other people can enjoy the resources) or a PM would be much appreciated.

[PNSD]

Not sur if it helps, but as im sure you would have seen, this site is brilliant...

http://gurneyflap.com/formula1renault.html

edit - btw car looks brilliant so far!

[eidetic]

Not sur if it helps, but as im sure you would have seen, this site is brilliant...

http://gurneyflap.com/formula1renault.html

edit - btw car looks brilliant so far!

Actually, I had not seen that site before. It looks awesome, and seems to have a lot of the types of images I'm looking for. Thank you very much for the link.

[Carlos]

May I welcome you both - PSND & Eidetic to the Forum and thank Eidetic for sharing his work - superb drawings - yes Gurneyflap is the perfect place for those details - good reference PSND. I hope you both enjoy fhe Forum as much as I do - Welcome.

[eidetic]

May I welcome you both - PSND & Eidetic to the Forum and thank Eidetic for sharing his work - superb drawings - yes Gurneyflap is the perfect place for those details - good reference PSND. I hope you both enjoy fhe Forum as much as I do - Welcome.

Oh, I already do enjoy the forum. Unfortunately, sometimes the wealth of knowledge on here is a bit overwhelming for me and I end up getting lost in the pages and end up not getting and work done on the virtual car

I haven't gone through all of Gurneyflap.com, but one thing I really lack source/reference pics for is the engine (as mounted in the car) and the gearbox. I've got all the usual RS26/RS27 and other team's engine pictures shot in the studios, but I lack any of them actually installed in the car and connected to the gearbox.

I forgot to say that I'd also appreciate if people nitpicked the car to the death as I work on it. While it is a "fantasy" car, I want it to be as realistic as possible. Something that wouldn't look out of place on the grid this weekend at Montreal (or anywhere for that matter). I'm basically going for as highly detailed as is possible. So basically I'd be looking for people to critique anything that looks wrong or unrealistic. Especially maybe considering what looks right or wrong when it comes to placement of the winglets, etc. For example, I'm not sure that the placement of the winglet behind the radiator chimney works right now. Maybe some aero experts can help point me in the right direction.

Right now the profile of the engine cover/intake needs work, I know that much.

I also want it to look fast as well, with maybe a sort of aggressive look to it.

Also, it's a ways off, but if F1technical.net doesn't mind, I'd like to put your logo on the car as a gesture of thanks, so if you'd (the site admins) would like, I'd be more than happy to place it on the car (and if you have a higher res logo other than just the one here on the site, that'd be great)

[checkered]

Hi, eidetic, nice to

meet you. The pictures look very impressive, clearly you have invested a lot in your effort already. Since you speak of a "modelled" F1 car I wonder what software you are using? Not necessarily in terms of a specific program(s), but in terms of whether you've got engineering, general design or 3D visualization programs. Your tools and approach will determine the end result somewhat and I guess also make it easier for the most knowledgeable participants to contribute with relevant information allowing you to concentrate on the essentials of what you're trying to achieve.

I see you might tend to think and go into some detail very quickly, perhaps "zooming" from general concepts to single parts and shapes and back. From personal experience (I tend to do that too and have also been criticized for that by more intellectually diciplined individuals) I can tell that sometimes the design process (not the design itself) might become a little structureless and hard to manage. That being said it is workable too, every approach has its up- and downsides. Anyway, don't worry about "pointless materials tests" - if those keep your motivation and interest high, they certainly serve an important purpose, too.

From time to time, there are private projects around that really are quite astonishing. Here's a link to the site of an (apparently) Italian guy, who designed an F1 car to (I think) the 2001 rules at the time. At first, the project might come across as nothing special (the documentation is a bit plain for such an extensive project), but as you surf through the site it becomes apparent that he has considered pretty much everything by himself and it seems even got support from actual F1 teams eventually! He used CATIA for the design part.

Edit:

You might also want to keep an eye on what IndyCar is doing about their designs towards 2011 ... they seem to have a very fearless approach to conceptual racecar design, partnering with Art Center College of Design to develop future ideas. I know I'm keeping an eye on it!

[eidetic]

Hi, eidetic, nice to

meet you. The pictures look very impressive, clearly you have invested a lot in your effort already. Since you speak of a "modelled" F1 car I wonder what software you are using? Not necessarily in terms of a specific program(s), but in terms of whether you've got engineering, general design or 3D visualization programs. Your tools and approach will determine the end result somewhat and I guess also make it easier for the most knowledgeable participants to contribute with relevant information allowing you to concentrate on the essentials of what you're trying to achieve.

I see you might tend to think and go into some detail very quickly, perhaps "zooming" from general concepts to single parts and shapes and back. From personal experience (I tend to do that too and have also been criticized for that by more intellectually diciplined individuals) I can tell that sometimes the design process (not the design itself) might become a little structureless and hard to manage. That being said it is workable too, every approach has its up- and downsides. Anyway, don't worry about "pointless materials tests" - if those keep your motivation and interest high, they certainly serve an important purpose, too.

From time to time, there are private projects around that really are quite astonishing. Here's a link to the site of an (apparently) Italian guy, who designed an F1 car to (I think) the 2001 rules at the time. At first, the project might come across as nothing special (the documentation is a bit plain for such an extensive project), but as you surf through the site it becomes apparent that he has considered pretty much everything by himself and it seems even got support from actual F1 teams eventually! He used CATIA for the design part.

Edit:

You might also want to keep an eye on what IndyCar is doing about their designs towards 2011 ... they seem to have a very fearless approach to conceptual racecar design, partnering with Art Center College of Design to develop future ideas. I know I'm keeping an eye on it!

Thanks for the comments, I appreciate them.

I'm definately coming from more of a 3D VFX type of background. (Using Maya, modo, etc, as opposed to Catia, Pro/E, etc) Most of my work related projects are basically product visualisation. Often taking CAD files and remodeling/retopologizing them when necessary, or working from blueprints/drawings. Kind of runs the gamut too, in that I've done work for car manufacturers, alcohol companies, stuff for an engine company (Briggs and Straton) among other other things.

As for starting off really detailed, it's how I prefer to work. I don't like being stuck focusing on one part at a time. I like to move around, it keeps everything fresh in a way. Also, for a project like this, it's almost better IMO for my workflow to go back and forth between parts. That way I can model everything together, and work with the individual parts so they all fit together as awhole. Instead of say, modeling one part, and then modeling another and having to force it to fit into/work with the already built piece.

As for getting help from teams, I've actually got access to some rather nice drawings given to me by Renault. This has helped for some of the internals such as the front brake resevoirs and interior (as in the nose of the car) of the suspension and steering components. I may contact some other teams in the near future as well.

[checkered]

Cool, I'm sure you'll

be able to develop a great design of your own (do you intend to go by the 2007 rules?) - and if the programs are compatible, who knows, there are some people here who might give some of your ideas a run with their CFD software and so on. I knew of Maya (and some other comparable software) on a more or less general basis, though I had to Google for modo. Btw, are you going for stills (as you mentioned high detail, that's certainly possible), or perhaps animations?

While the "Italian job" I referred to had a solid engineering backround to it, there are other kinds of efforts too ... before this season started there was an example of an effort on the other side of the "visual-engineering" scale. An Australian architect (Kim Stapleton) had basically re-mapped an R25 (I think) with an Audi racing livery. Even that fairly straightforward exercise got a fair share of publicity. And why not, it looked good. I wonder if he got the 3D model straight from Renault by any chance?

A thread discussing the Audi livery
The original link to the pics

[eidetic]

Cool, I'm sure you'll

be able to develop a great design of your own (do you intend to go by the 2007 rules?) - and if the programs are compatible, who knows, there are some people here who might give some of your ideas a run with their CFD software and so on. I knew of Maya (and some other comparable software) on a more or less general basis, though I had to Google for modo. Btw, are you going for stills (as you mentioned high detail, that's certainly possible), or perhaps animations?

While the "Italian job" I referred to had a solid engineering backround to it, there are other kinds of efforts too ... before this season started there was an example of an effort on the other side of the "visual-engineering" scale. An Australian architect (Kim Stapleton) had basically re-mapped an R25 (I think) with an Audi racing livery. Even that fairly straightforward exercise got a fair share of publicity. And why not, it looked good. I wonder if he got the 3D model straight from Renault by any chance?

A thread discussing the Audi livery
The original link to the pics

Yeah, I had seen that before. It's actually the R26.

Here's some older work of mine, that for one reason or another, never got finished:

R26, never finished:


A car I made a few years back, I think from about 2004 or 2005:




A car I recently started, but decided to change the look of as well as the topology of the model itself.

[Tom]

Welcome to THE forum eidetic, those CADs are stunning, you must have alot of patience.

For technical drawing the best site must be http://www.scarbsf1.com/

[checkered]

Some notions on

the "body_001" image. These are not design suggestions by any measure, just comparisons between that image and some general '07 spec trends.

1) I think it is unusual to see (a large array) of "shark gills" with the "cooling chimneys". They mostly serve the same function, so your picture would suggest a design that has been compromised for very hot conditions (there's a drag penalty). Even so, it's very rare to see these two elements go together, usually designers either add more gills or widen the chimneys if extra cooling is needed.

2) The top edge of the air box tends to have a two-dimensional fin these days, the real volume starting only lower in the structure. The engine and the accompanying elements are very tightly packaged but since the rules stipulate that there's got to be a certain area (for advertising, I'd guess) to be seen from the side of the car, that's how it is achieved.

Of course it's a bit boring to see the same themes repeated everywhere, so if you want to try out something else, I'm all for it.

[Militia Est Vita]

Amazing work and amazing drawings, you should PLEASE make some wallpapaers available after you are done! thosu would kick ass as desktop backgrounds. Keep it up!

[eidetic]

Some notions on

the "body_001" image. These are not design suggestions by any measure, just comparisons between that image and some general '07 spec trends.

1) I think it is unusual to see (a large array) of "shark gills" with the "cooling chimneys". They mostly serve the same function, so your picture would suggest a design that has been compromised for very hot conditions (there's a drag penalty). Even so, it's very rare to see these two elements go together, usually designers either add more gills or widen the chimneys if extra cooling is needed.

2) The top edge of the air box tends to have a two-dimensional fin these days, the real volume starting only lower in the structure. The engine and the accompanying elements are very tightly packaged but since the rules stipulate that there's got to be a certain area (for advertising, I'd guess) to be seen from the side of the car, that's how it is achieved.

Of course it's a bit boring to see the same themes repeated everywhere, so if you want to try out something else, I'm all for it.

Hey, thanks for the advice. I do plan on re profiling the engine cover, you can see it's kind of oddly shaped in the cross section right now.

For the shark gills, I just really liked the look of the R25 when it came to those. It really gives the car an almost organic feeling I think. You are right however, and I sort of laid out the topology in that area to easily "close" some of them up. I may just leave the ones surrounding the chimney and up to the winglet that sticks up from the body work. I'm also going to actually do a few different variations on the body work (and probably two all different models all together), so I plan on keeping this version as well, with all the gills open.

Amazing work and amazing drawings, you should PLEASE make some wallpapaers available after you are done! thosu would kick ass as desktop backgrounds. Keep it up!

Don't worry, I'll be doing plenty of wallpaper-suitable renders


So livery ideas, anyone got some?

I'm thinking one simple livery, an old school, simple livery. British racing green, yellow stripe, and black on a white circle number decals on the sidepods. Then maybe a more "corporate" BP livery scheme, again green and yellow colors. Naturally I'll also be doing a red livery, either marlboro or maybe Coca Cola or some other company sponsor that would fit with a red livery. Suggestions?

[mx_tifoso]

I'm thinking one simple livery, an old school, simple livery. British racing green, yellow stripe, and black on a white circle number decals on the sidepods. Then maybe a more "corporate" BP livery scheme, again green and yellow colors. Naturally I'll also be doing a red livery, either marlboro or maybe Coca Cola or some other company sponsor that would fit with a red livery. Suggestions?

An old school type livery would look very very good, in any color you put on those cars you have created.

Have you thought about "Vodaphone red"?
I know its going to be an obvious color coming from me, but Rosso Corsa, with a sponsor using similar colors.

Great looking designs by the way!

[mx_tifoso]

it wont let me erase this dumb double post!!
I just want to erase this one, not the one above, hint hint

Thanks in advance.