since many of us are talking here about seeing McLaren going a little under, I was wondering what we should do for the MP4/19B to make it at least a decent McLaren car.
My guesses are actually a new rear suspension (there will be a considerable update to this in Imola I thought for the MP4/19). When you look at Bahrain, you could see the McLarens have a hard time to keep up when accellerating out of sharp slow corners.
Second thing I guess we will eventually see it a modified nose cone.. I think there won't be many changes there, but in my opinion it simply must be a little higher than it is now. There's simply too much downforce lost in the centre of the front wing at the moment... so the slow cornering
it ´s quite easy to slam someone for underachieving,as we can see from some flashes of performance in recent weeks I do not really think the Mac is a complete desaster.
I think Mclaren misses out in maximising its potential.I would send Mr Neway back to the drawing board to design nextyears car as a first measure.
Next I would give Mr.illien what he needs to do the engine that is needed to challenge the other teams.
Then I would look into the suspension geometry and have long thioughts if the philosophy they follow is the correct one,the way they use their tyres.
Interesting to hear that both drivers complain of difficulty of placing the car...Is this a understeer problem?or a instability under braking (flexing /twin keel???) or is it a visibility problem?Maybe they cure their traction problem by placing ballast to the back and so they get a chassis imbalance leading to their turnin understeer..just a guess ....
Maybe the aeroside is too ride height sensitive and so they have to run the car too stiff loosing traction in that...
interstingly enough I just read an interview with mister cioulthard in autosport,saying key people at mclaren have lost the plot and some key players would soon leave...
And he said braking was a strength of the car as well as turnin.
the problem would creep in on midcorner where the thing was just going away from him and would not hold line,as well as have no traction.
What a mess...Ifeel they need to bin their complete aeropackage as well as their suspension.....
Mostly changes under the skin. The current car can produce one sizzling lap but cannot be consistent enough during the race(tyre degration??like jaguar last year??).One of the most beautiful car to me on the outside.
More changes to the engine of course, poor heat dispersal(even with gold coating)at the rear.It's all about intregration They got all winter to do it but still can't get it right. Perhaps its time to find someone from CART or IRl...some of them might be interested in the challenge of F1...
Someone once said, German cannot work under British supremacy, I say let MB (Mercedes Benz) take over the team and let them restore themselves to their former glory days....
Interesting one,and as far as i can see there's only two ways McLaren can go about it...
1) Strike up a partership with Ferrari and talk them into releasing engines and gearboxes for the new car...or...
2) Hire a former Ferrari employee that carries more interlectual property than Einstein,make a good copy of the car and see what happens.
I will warn you though that even then,neither of these are likely to give the desired success
"Whether you think you can or can't, either way you are right."
-Henry Ford-
Scuderia_Russ wrote:
1) Strike up a partership with Ferrari and talk them into releasing engines and gearboxes for the new car...or...
that is not possible. They are two great rivals and you want that McLaren will drive with a Ferrari engine. Keenp on dreaming.There's no chance it will happen.
One thing that irked me about the recent outburst by Coulthard is that he is not acting like a real leader and/or veteran of a team that has been very good to him for nine seasons (?).
I mean come on, Ferrari had troubles at the beginning of last year (admittedly not as bad as Mclaren this year) but not once did we hear Schumacher complain that Ferrari have 'lost' their way. Instead, most of his comments revolved around we will beat this and so on. Hate him as I might, I admire that quality in him. Even Kimi, who has had a worse time than Coulthard hasn't lashed out as such. Not very 'corporate' on Coulthard's part especially because he did nothing in the other years when he did have the best car. Might just be calls for attention from a dying breed.
So what would I do to make the MP4/19B better? "Get rid of Coulthard." (Who likes him anyway? And I think Wurz would be just good of a Corporate promoter as Coulthard!)
Go back to the McLaren MP4/17D. At least Raikkonen was able to get a grip of 2nd's. Unless McLaren want to take this season as a very painful learning curve.
It's funny how Coulthard had to prove that he is worth every penny now that he's leaving McLaren, and he has more points than Kimi already.
Bring back wider rear wings, V10s, and tobacco advertisements
going backwards(to /17) is never a prospect ,I´m sure it is not fast enough anymore,F1 is going forward not standing still in theses times.
You are right ,Mclaren wouldnot win if they had a ferrari standing in their garage,as well as sauber doesn`t.....
It is a problem of people,as I said,beginning with drivers,Coulthard is a good driver ,but let´s face it he is not in the same league as hakkinen was ,let alone Michael schumacher.
In all those years one never has heard michael bad mouthing anyone working with him,even in times when nothing seemed to go right.
We heard the likes of Montoya and Ralf complain :If we had the Ferrari we would be champs too...that is not true ,because if they were in the team it would not be as good ,and they would not have ever achieved what michael did.And I bet Michael would have claimed the championship in a williams as well .think about it.
I really think the whole bunch of drivers at mclaren is not really suited to steer and give direction I would sack them all.They were unable to develop the car and give feedback suitable to make the progress needed.
One has to see that good times of Mclaren Mercedes were ,when Panis was testing and Hakkinen driving.
The problem with the MP4-19 is not a lack of pace. The testing times in Valencia and elsewhere prove this. Over one hot lap this car is senstional. The major problem is reliability. I doubt that this is due to the Mercedes engine alone. I believe that it is down to the integration between the chassis and engine. The MP4-19's rear end is so incredibly tightly packed. Certain pictures allow us to see just how tightly the rear end tapers in, it is quite rediculous. The problem here is the same as on the 18A. Cooling suffers, and components are too tighly packed together. Cooling not only affects the engine but also the Hydraulics. Because of this the silver arrows are having to "tune down" the engine by running it on lower revs. This decreases power but on the plus side it increases reliability by decreasing engine stress and also means the engine desn't run as hot. This is what we are seeing in qualifying and the races. The car must be setup in qualy 2, as it is for the race. So in Qualy2 the engine must be tuned down (although it can be argued that this can be done from the cockpit after te qualy lap). Why then is there no pace in the other sessions? the answer is simple, Mclaren are not a poor F1 team. They know that there is no piont in running high RPM in practice sessions because it interfere's with the perfect race setup, it adds wear on the engine, and they know that a team like mclaren do not need to show off pace and loose it in the race...that isn't good PR skills.
To move towards some sort of improvement Mclaren need to be more conventional and repackage the rear end. Also I read a report about the gearbox, it is a Titanium-Composite struscture. The problem here is that carbonfibre and titanium don't bond well. And the gearbox can sometimes, quite literally, fall to pieces. They need a more conventinal rear end to the car, and if they slowly develop this concept then they can be where they are now with regards to packaging in 2006, but WITHOUT the problems they are suffering this year.[/quote]
sorry,what do you mean by integration?
I feel the Mclaren must be a very integrated design,as it is possible to change engine in a real hurry(but why does it explode then?).In my opinion all is a matter of motivation and directing forces in apositive manner.
Maybe being quick in Valencia does not mean a lot ,when you struggle next day at Barcelona...a track all teams know well enough to have setupdata to be on the pace instantly.
Why the hell should one drive 13oookm in the winter and not knowing how to setup the car ,what did they do?They must have reference data from the car before ,and they surely know what others are capable of.
It remains a mystery and perhaps some forces within the team do not even want the car to perform....ever thought of some frustrated guy just not paying attention?It is easier to post a dnf than doing a job good enough to make it to the finish.....Ferraris Art is not being perfect,nobody is,but bringing their cars home week after week....
Mercedes engies explode because Ilmor-built Merecedes F1-engines have never been the state-of-the-art, hell last season BMW, Ferrari, and likely Toyota and Honda were all making more power than the Mercedes unit. Its never been the strong point of the car, but rather its been enough that when coupled with a stellar McLaren chassis and top shelf drivers like Kimi and Mika, it can contend for the title.
Merecedes needs to --- or get off the pot. BMW came back into the game 5 years ago and they are already heralded in most circles as the most powerful engine on the grid. Though I am a BMW owner and JPM fan i still give the nod to the 053 Ferrari engine over the P84 based on robust reliability and no clear power disadvantage. Amidst this all, the rules suddenly stipulate 3 times the duty cycle per engine with a 10-position penalty for those who fail. While MB has half-stepped the engine job since day 1 they've managed, but the increased stress for the new motors was simply more than they could come up with. Tough break, sucks for Kimi.. i hate it for him, and i fear for JPM's career if tides don't turn. Williams seems to be next in line.. or Honda?
I don't know enough about the particulars to say what is wrong the the /19, but based on what i do know about fluid dynamics the FW26 is a much better way of doing it than the /19. However, i'd give McLaren a point for style cause damn the /19 is one sinister looking car!
I'd imagine a wider and higher nose with perhaps a more tradition rear end, i agree with whomever mentioned them being a little too far ahead of their time with the transaxle. And Ferrari is basically perfect whoever said they're not.. i pull for Williams, but Ferrari is a swiss clock, they have it down to a fine science and they deserve everything they achieve. I'll be damned if Michael isn't the best ever.. Senna was amazing, Schuey is more so.
The Scuderia continue to perform their symphony flawlessly weekend after weekend. The Merecedes engine (its code isnt worth remembering)
are you serious abou coulthard worth his reatainer?
Jaguars Klien is a PAYdriver actually and he is quite impressive I have to say.Coulthard earns millions of dollars,but instead of hard work you hear him moaning about other teammembers and slamming the cow that feeds him,not so clever ,Toyota will have noticed that as well as ralfs conduct.
As a driver you have to work hard to improve the package till qualifying
and come qualy and race you have to maximise on what you have,end of story.Coulthard does not give the impression that he ever got it right in qualifying,and starts his races from a compromised grid position.
Hearin Dennis say :we always work on racespeed ,I can only laugh ,as the race starts with that one lap qualifier....Why spend millions to make the car one tenth of a second faster a lap and throwing away 5 (or more)seconds before the race has even started?
I'm sure ppl at mclaren thought of all the things u guys just said but if the engine was the main problem its not gonna be easily cured...as u see in renault's case its not an overnight work...
hmm idd well maybe a good idea for the Mp4/19 would be chimneys... a couple of years ago they introduced them, and meanwhile several topteams show the benefits it can have.
When they would develop if as streamlined as on the Renault, it could prove very beneficial in terms of cooling, without reducing aerodynamic performance considerably.
