2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

[Gillian]

Is this new ICE running right now at the FP1 or should be put it in place after the FP3?
What if they are running it now and then another one before qualy? He could get another 10 places grid penalty?

If you take an additional element, you are not allowed to stock them up. If he takes Nr. 5, the Nr. 4 is eliminated and can not be used anymore. So this does not make sense unless Nr. 4 is defective like it was for Bot.

You can "stock" them provided you take all your penalties. The rule to stop "stocking" was when Honda was taking two or three complete sets and only serving one "back of the grid" penalty. Although now I think about it even if he qualified on pole he couldn't serve two ten place grid drops ...

You are only allowed a pool of 3 engines. I think what Basti says is true. You keep the engine you used in the race. But correct me if I'm wrong...

[PlatinumZealot]

The good news is that McLarens seem less competitive here as they can be a pain to pass.

[El Scorchio]

Not sure whether the thinking is to take parts over a few races? Not to take away from VERs recovery in Sochi, but he was never in contention to better HAM let alone a win. Maybe this leaves the pressure on RB/VER a bit more.

That would be mad wouldn't it? You're just conceding the win race after race by constantly giving yourself grid penalties. Far better to just do all the pain in one race.

The calculus would be that 10 positions is not enough of a penalty to remove the possibility of a HAM win. I guess it depends if VER qualifies ahead and is allowed to run & hide. Either way, it’s a better way to maximise the strengths/motivations. HAM usually has blistering race pace & can make up the deficit and BOT is up front & hungry, staring at maybe his final ever win. I think this is more sensible way to play the BOT hand. Just my musings

I understand in theory that seems sound, but Verstappen would, assuming nothing goes wrong for him, be able to open up a 10-15 second gap easily in the first 10-15 laps or any race given the relative pace of the cars sitting between them, and those cars will not be easy to breeze past as we've seen in the last few races. And he would rag it at the start to get a big gap to cover a pit stop. Don't forget Perez will likely be between them as well, run long, and hold Hamilton up. As for Bottas, it's a shame to say it, but he has shown no ability (or maybe even desire?) to keep Verstappen behind him when it counts.

To add, Hamilton would take a lot out of his tyres making up positions and likely end up in a situation like Verstappen was in Sochi until the rain came to his aid. He wasn't sniffing the top six before that happened, and may even have finished 8th or 9th.

[atanatizante]

So HAM should be focused solely on race pace and a higher top speed RW set up in order to have better chances of overtaking, something that VER has done at Sochi ... with one caveat: HAM should start at the front of the middle pack on hard tyres opting for a long first stint and probably trying a one-stop race strategy ... or he needs to start the race on the same tyres he qualified at Q2? if that`s so, then he should concentrate on hard tyre qualy simulations in FP2 and FP3 ...

Thus, BOT should focus only on qualy set up in order to grab the pole and hold off back VER as much as he could do it ...

[Gillian]

That would be mad wouldn't it? You're just conceding the win race after race by constantly giving yourself grid penalties. Far better to just do all the pain in one race.

The calculus would be that 10 positions is not enough of a penalty to remove the possibility of a HAM win. I guess it depends if VER qualifies ahead and is allowed to run & hide. Either way, it’s a better way to maximise the strengths/motivations. HAM usually has blistering race pace & can make up the deficit and BOT is up front & hungry, staring at maybe his final ever win. I think this is more sensible way to play the BOT hand. Just my musings

I understand in theory that seems sound, but Verstappen would, assuming nothing goes wrong for him, be able to open up a 10-15 second gap easily in the first 10-15 laps or any race given the relative pace of the cars sitting between them, and those cars will not be easy to breeze past as we've seen in the last few races. And he would rag it at the start to get a big gap to cover a pit stop. Don't forget Perez will likely be between them as well, run long, and hold Hamilton up. As for Bottas, it's a shame to say it, but he has shown no ability (or maybe even desire?) to keep Verstappen behind him when it counts.

To add, Hamilton would take a lot out of his tyres making up positions and likely end up in a situation like Verstappen was in Sochi until the rain came to his aid. He wasn't sniffing the top six before that happened, and may even have finished 8th or 9th.

Totally agree but I wonder if that's exactly the reason why they would prefer a 10 place drop instead of dead last? I mean, those few places further ahead might be the difference between a P7ish or a podium.

[El Scorchio]

So HAM should be focused solely on race pace and a higher top speed RW set up in order to have better chances of overtaking, something that VER has done at Sochi ... with one caveat: HAM should start at the front of the middle pack on hard tyres opting for a long first stint and probably trying a one-stop race strategy ... or he needs to start the race on the same tyres he qualified at Q2? if that`s so, then he should concentrate on hard tyre qualy simulations in FP2 and FP3 ...

Thus, BOT should focus only on qualy set up in order to grab the pole and hold off back VER as much as he could do it ...

He won;t have a luxury of tyre choice if he's going to start 11th. He'll still have to start on what he finished Q2 on, AND still get pole in Q3 to start there. If he wants free tyre choice for the race then he has to not go through to Q3, but then he starts 20th.

[darkpino]

No one here who thinks it’s odd that Bottas had to change the complete PU twice in two races but Lewis can only replace the ICE?

[AeroDynamic]

No one here who thinks it’s odd that Bottas had to change the complete PU twice in two races but Lewis can only replace the ICE?

Not really. There was a rumour they want to understand how hard they can push the engines, it’s possible they’ve been trying to study the engine and used Bottas to achieve that

Could be pivotal in improving the engine for next year.

[El Scorchio]

I think they did it tactically to try and hold up Verstappen, although they'd never say that's why they did it. Bottas just for whatever reason didn't do what was required of him at all.

[darkpino]

Isn’t it written in the rules that the engine can only be changed because of safety concerns? That would explain why Mercedes isn’t being honest about it

[Just_a_fan]

Isn’t it written in the rules that the engine can only be changed because of safety concerns? That would explain why Mercedes isn’t being honest about it

They can change the engine if they wish but have to take a penalty each time. They could put a new engine in every race if they wished, but they would never start from better than P11 at each race. That would be a big gamble, which is why they don't do it.

[Gillian]

Isn’t it written in the rules that the engine can only be changed because of safety concerns? That would explain why Mercedes isn’t being honest about it

What you are talking about applies to engine upgrades, not spec-for-spec engine swap.

[El Scorchio]

Isn’t it written in the rules that the engine can only be changed because of safety concerns? That would explain why Mercedes isn’t being honest about it

They can change the engine if they wish but have to take a penalty each time. They could put a new engine in every race if they wished, but they would never start from better than P11 at each race. That would be a big gamble, which is why they don't do it.

Exactly. I just think if that was the reason, it's not something they'd want to overly advertise.

However, it's only a suspicion and it might well have been a necessary change. We shall never know! Evidence to suggest it was a necessary change was Bottas' complete failure to even inconvenience Verstappen for a single corner.

[atanatizante]

It seems that after FP2 results HAM needs to start on the medium tyre and try to stay out longer in the first stint in order to make a one-stop M-H race doable ...

Regarding race pace, it also seems that W12 is on average 4 to 5 tenths faster than RB16B on the medium tyres but of course, we don`t know the engine modes they used, fuels and so forth, although the rumours on the paddock are saying that Merc is running with more fuel than RB but the latter is using a lower PU mode in these FP2 race simulation runs ...

Could be LEC (or both Ferrari drivers) be the dark horse and slot between Merc and RB here regarding race pace/race results? Should be fun to watch ...

[dans79]

It seems that after FP2 results HAM needs to start on the medium tyre and try to stay out longer in the first stint in order to make a one-stop M-H race doable ...

Regarding race pace, it also seems that W12 is on average 4 to 5 tenths faster than RB16B on the medium tyres but of course, we don`t know the engine modes they used, fuels and so forth, although the rumours on the paddock are saying that Merc is running with more fuel than RB but the latter is using a lower PU mode in these FP2 race simulation runs ...

Could be LEC (or both Ferrari drivers) be the dark horse and slot between Merc and RB here regarding race pace/race results? Should be fun to watch ...

Red Bull was very hard to read today. Max was having balance issues, while checko didn't appear to and was actually faster than Max.

Ferrari looks fast over one run, but in the long runs they were following away from Merc, the longer the sting went on.

Without doing a detailed analysis, Merc is looking pretty strong here imo.