2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
jambuka
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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AR3-GP
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An interesting write up: https://www.funoanalisitecnica.com/2023 ... sioni.html

The problem is therefore to be found in the nonlinear reactions of the individual elements. With a higher imposed load, the suspensive response is not the desired one and, consequently, the position of the bottom does not remain within the range estimated by the project. To this must be added the endemic lack of vertical thrust, accentuated by the need to further unload the car to limit the speed gap that the SF-23 suffers on Red Bull, a super efficient car in aerodynamic terms.
A lion must kill its prey.

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falonso81
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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jambuka wrote:
03 May 2023, 16:05
New sidepods in Miami
https://scuderiafans.com/f1-ferrari-rev ... rand-prix/
Well, i hope they are not only run on Friday and then disappear into oblivion.

Andi76
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deadhead wrote:
28 Apr 2023, 22:27
Andi76 wrote:
28 Apr 2023, 17:47
dialtone wrote:
28 Apr 2023, 16:33
Fact is, LEC got on pole thanks to S2 and a very good S1. Both of those sectors are the slower stuff where traction means a lot, this was NOT the case in Bahrain. There's reason to really believe Ferrari found something to improve the car over the break via improvements in setup because their S3 is equally strong as RBR.

Will it be enough for the race? Before seeing telemetry or any race sim I highly doubt it, but that should put them clear 2nd best car.

EDIT: SAI on the other hand is pretty inexcusable right now and given LEC's rumors of looking for some leverage for new contract negotiation I wouldn't risk losing a guy that is so much faster in quali/race on average.
I think this can be explained quite well by the development history of the SF-23, at least if the rumors I have heard are true, and it would make sense. Binotto and Sanchez wanted the SF-23 to continue in the same direction as the F1-75. However, which is said to have been one of the reasons for Binotto's falling out with Vigna and also for Sanchez's decision to leave, Vigna must have interfered (a very normal practice at Ferrari since 2007 and before 1996) in the development and demanded lower drag. A Ferrari was not likely to be outrun by a Red Bull on the straights. This messed up a lot of the SF-23 and downforce was sacrificed in favor of drag, hence Vigna's "from the fastest Ferrari" comment at the presentation. I think there was a turnaround (and Vigna made it happen based on the results) and they went after downforce, as Sanchez and Binotto actually wanted, which brought the SF-23 and its concept back into balance. The fact that they went back to Rory Byrne six weeks ago and are listening to him again certainly helps. So everything would fit together. But first we'll have to wait and see.
So he just couldn't handle being outdone on the straight by a Honda powered car? That's really shortsighted.
Let's put it this way - it's quite common at Ferrari for the bosses to interfere in technical development and demand things that are anything but clever. Not only do they often mess up the technical development and the development plan (which is also the reason why Ferrari is generally at a disadvantage in development during the season compared to other top teams), but they also put the engineers in a stupid situation. What is an engineer supposed to do now? Do something that is actually, as he knows, not useful for the vehicle? Or just ignore it, which makes him vulnerable, because if others notice it and report it, his position or even his job is in danger. On the other hand, if he follows this and the car ultimately becomes worse or one loses direction in development, it is the same. This is what you have to deal with at Ferrari and what happens there unfortunately. There was a time when that didn't happen, when Ross Brawn and Rory Byrne came in and stopped that, as well as the politics in the whole engineering department, which was ultimately headed by Rory, who in turn reported to Ross. Rory didn't tolerate any politics, he didn't have a political bone in his body, all that mattered was the performance of the car, same with Ross. But they could only do this because, on the one hand, their contracts stated that they had full technical responsibility and, on the other hand, because Michael Schumacher would have left immediately if Ross or Rory had been dismissed. Therefore Montezemolo and Co. had no choice but to stay out of it when Ross demanded it (which he did). Before this era it was quite different. Likewise afterwards. Almost on a weekly basis, people like Vigna interfere. Binotto and Sanchez actually wanted to give the SF-23 a completely different development focus.

saviour stivala
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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In formula one nothing beat rumors especially about the inner workings of FERRARI as a story building tool.

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Vanja #66
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Rivals feel Ferrari “not always pushing PU to maximum” amid possible reliability concerns

https://scuderiafans.com/rivals-feel-fe ... -concerns/

Baku Top Speeds seem to indeed prove this, especially compared to Jeddah results, where the car had a massively oversized rear wing this year.

Image

Image

With power available in Jeddah, Ferrari would have had at least 3-4kmh more in Baku Q and poof - no one would be talking about RB mighty DRS :lol:
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And they call it a stall. A STALL!

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AR3-GP
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
03 May 2023, 21:36
Rivals feel Ferrari “not always pushing PU to maximum” amid possible reliability concerns

https://scuderiafans.com/rivals-feel-fe ... -concerns/

Baku Top Speeds seem to indeed prove this, especially compared to Jeddah results, where the car had a massively oversized rear wing this year.

https://i.ibb.co/7R5gtkV/2022-23-baku-q.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/VHyVGSn/2022-23-jeddah-q.jpg

With power available in Jeddah, Ferrari would have had at least 3-4kmh more in Baku Q and poof - no one would be talking about RB mighty DRS :lol:
It requires quite a bit of power at top speed to generate an extra "3-4km/h". Drag is the biggest factor in top speeds. I know that you know this Vanja :wink: :lol:
A lion must kill its prey.

Vinlarr89
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Looks like the PU has been turned down since Jeddah looking at that. Unless a dramatically different aero setup in Jeddah from 22? If that is the case Ferrari need to fix all these little 1% very quickly if they want to bounce back!

KimiRai
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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According to Italian journalist Leo Turrini Dan Fallows had an offer from Matia Binotto to join Ferrari in 2021 for 2022 season, but Fallows chose to leave Redbull for Aston Martin instead due to better conditions

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Juzh
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
03 May 2023, 21:36
Rivals feel Ferrari “not always pushing PU to maximum” amid possible reliability concerns

https://scuderiafans.com/rivals-feel-fe ... -concerns/

Baku Top Speeds seem to indeed prove this, especially compared to Jeddah results, where the car had a massively oversized rear wing this year.

https://i.ibb.co/7R5gtkV/2022-23-baku-q.jpg

https://i.ibb.co/VHyVGSn/2022-23-jeddah-q.jpg

With power available in Jeddah, Ferrari would have had at least 3-4kmh more in Baku Q and poof - no one would be talking about RB mighty DRS :lol:
what good is a pu that constantly needs turning down? at some point you gotta take it run with it, and results that come out of it are valid. if that ferrari pu can run at those +3-4 kmh but only for 2 or 3 races then you can't call that power level a baseline, can you?

even so, i still think ferrari ICE itself is the most powerful by around 5-10 hp and honda pu has the best ers. Mercedes is not bad but excels in no area, same as renault but even further behind (still very close nowadays).

jambuka
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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So basically they are stuck with an engine they can't make reliable after a year and a car which they can't improve in race pace. :P

jambuka
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Whose turn is it to perform well and feel good about the car ? Carlos or Charles ? Since we can’t seem to have both performing well.

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Vanja #66
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Juzh wrote:
03 May 2023, 23:12
what good is a pu that constantly needs turning down?
Image

It's becoming increasingly clear Binotto's team did only one good thing - aerodynamic development. Seeing how much the suspenion design is still lacking shows they basically lucked into good setup range before TD39, otherwise they would have been able to repeat that with little issues. On the PU side, no words at all...
AeroGimli.x

And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

jambuka
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
04 May 2023, 06:40
Juzh wrote:
03 May 2023, 23:12
what good is a pu that constantly needs turning down?
https://media1.giphy.com/media/E1dZTkbm ... .webp&ct=g

It's becoming increasingly clear Binotto's team did only one good thing - aerodynamic development. Seeing how much the suspenion design is still lacking shows they basically lucked into good setup range before TD39, otherwise they would have been able to repeat that with little issues. On the PU side, no words at all...
Isn't Wolf Zimmerman in charge of 2026 PU as well ?

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Wouter
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Re: 2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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KimiRai wrote:
03 May 2023, 22:35
According to Italian journalist Leo Turrini Dan Fallows had an offer from Matia Binotto to join Ferrari in 2021 for 2022 season, but Fallows chose to leave Redbull for Aston Martin instead due to better conditions
.
He and Franco Nugnes also said that Enrico Balbo from RBR was already working for Ferrari and another top engineer,
probably Waché.
As usual from Franco Nugnes it was his own story.

https://www.gazzetta.it/motori/ferrari/ ... refresh_ce
.
The Cavallino therefore went on to counterattack. And the target is obviously Red Bull's top engineers. But the attempt so far does not appear to have been successful.
There was an assault on the Piedmontese Enrico Balbo, aerodynamics chief of Red Bull, but the negotiations would have
immediately stopped due to the latter's refusal to leave Milton Keynes.

In addition, Pierre Waché, the technical director of the world champion team, was contacted. But even in this case the proposal would have been rejected.

More engineers are arriving at Ferrari, but they would be mid-level figures, such as the twenty who recruited Mattia Binotto last year (also from Red Bull) and who are now already working in Maranello. In any case, the new ones, when they sign, will be required to observe a break before being able to take up service at Ferrari, due to the "non-competition" clauses included in the contracts. It will therefore take some time before the reinforcement plan takes shape completely, provided that it goes through.
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