2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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runningmanz
runningmanz
5
Joined: 25 May 2021, 14:57

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Amazing qualli from Oscar! So close to first P1 in F1 qualli. Solid from Lando too.

FittingMechanics
FittingMechanics
16
Joined: 19 Feb 2019, 12:10

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:38
FittingMechanics wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:20
SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:09


The 3 tenths are found in Bruxelles (1 corner)… The rest of the lap they are pretty even, with Lando having an slight edge in the first sector
Can you compare the last chicane? And compare to VER/SAI.

Verstappen looks like on rails in that chicane.
Before the last chicane, Piastri is ahead of Sainz by 0.224, losing 2 tenths to Sainz in the chicane alone… Lando actually loses 1 tenth against Piastri in the chicane also.

By the time they hit the chicane, Lando was matching Sainz in terms of lap time (almost identical)… And as an additional reference point, Piastri loses 1 tenth to Hamilton also at the chicane
Thank you. So it is not drag in S3, it is the chicane where car doesn't change direction well. This is what they warned about. Slow with change of direction is worse for them.

Strange that they lost time in S1 before Eau Rouge.

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
479
Joined: 10 Mar 2019, 03:54

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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BMMR61 wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:19
SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:09
BMMR61 wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:46
Is this Spa race setup conundrum something that better simulation tools can effect?
A better simulator will definitely help with setup, more importantly to arrive at a track with a better pre-planned setup and allowed to make adjustments in between sessions… But if you mean by conundrum, which part of the lap you favor (the top speed dependent S1 and S3, or the DF dependent S2) will be based on the car strengths / weaknesses… Given the strengths of the car, I would have also favor S2, specially looking at the race more than just 1 lap pace.
Yeah exactly. With our very limited data we sometimes seem to find fault in how the team present their car setup. We’re just keyboard warriors when it comes down to it!

So the scenario for our S2 oriented setup is that the extra downforce will give greater and longer race pace with lower degradation, would you say?
That’s what I believe they are aiming for… A higher DF setup is usually more beneficial during a whole race stint due to a few factors:

A) Lower tire degradation: If you have low DF setup, you would be sliding more out of corners, the more the car slides the higher the temp on the tires as well as more degradation from them… Lower deg allows you to maintain a higher lap time during the whole stint instead of a quick drop off by the end of it.

B) More speed during the lift and coast portion of the race: After the first few laps of the race, when things settle a bit, the teams go into lift and coast… Tire and fuel management is still a big part of the game, with a higher DF setup you can gain plenty of time in the corners, a higher minimum cornering speed allows you to gain time while “off throttle” as well as to increase your cornering exit speed (which will impact your speed through a whole straight)

C) Build a Tire Delta to attack: If your tire degradation is lower while your maintains a good average lap time, you should be able to extent your stints versus your competitors… If you can build a tire delta, you should be able to attack in the final stages of the race, younger tires = better grip = better corner exit and better braking performance = opportunity for overtakes.

D) Create a favorable PitStop environment: If you can extent your first stint more than your direct competitors, you may be able to Pit in a favorable gap, one of the biggest challenges tomorrow will be to avoid pitting and coming behind a Williams for example and waste time (and tires) trying to overtake them… If you can extend your stint in a way that either you build a gap or the cars close to your Pit Window pit first, you can come out in clean air and take advantage of the new rubber.

All the above are of course correct on paper, but during the race everything can change with a bad timed (for McLaren) safety car and things of that nature… But it all depends on what the strategy and target positions are, I don’t think McLaren is aiming for a podium at this track, they are probably aiming at a solid P5-P6 which would be outstanding… The goal isn’t to overtake cars in front of them, the goal is to settle behind the Red Bulls and maybe the Ferraris or Mercedes and build a gap to the pack… Take advantage of the speed in S2 to slowly but surely build a gap towards the cars in P7-P15 and bring good points at a track that is probably one of the hardest for the team in the calendar.

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
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Joined: 10 Mar 2019, 03:54

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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FittingMechanics wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:26
SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:38
FittingMechanics wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:20


Can you compare the last chicane? And compare to VER/SAI.

Verstappen looks like on rails in that chicane.
Before the last chicane, Piastri is ahead of Sainz by 0.224, losing 2 tenths to Sainz in the chicane alone… Lando actually loses 1 tenth against Piastri in the chicane also.

By the time they hit the chicane, Lando was matching Sainz in terms of lap time (almost identical)… And as an additional reference point, Piastri loses 1 tenth to Hamilton also at the chicane
Thank you. So it is not drag in S3, it is the chicane where car doesn't change direction well. This is what they warned about. Slow with change of direction is worse for them.

Strange that they lost time in S1 before Eau Rouge.
There is time lost in S3 due to drag, both Sainz and Hamilton recover part of the time lost in S2 in that section… I will post the telemetry for Lando, Oscar, Carlos and Hamilton in a minute

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
479
Joined: 10 Mar 2019, 03:54

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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I was going to do a write up, but I don’t think people will waste their time reading it, lol… So instead, here is the telemetry comparison for the Sprint Shootout between the 2 McLaren drivers and the best positioned Ferrari (Caros) and Mercedes (Lewis)… A lot of interesting conclusions that could be driven from it:

Image

Image

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Juzh
161
Joined: 06 Oct 2012, 08:45

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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FittingMechanics wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:26
SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:38
FittingMechanics wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 14:20


Can you compare the last chicane? And compare to VER/SAI.

Verstappen looks like on rails in that chicane.
Before the last chicane, Piastri is ahead of Sainz by 0.224, losing 2 tenths to Sainz in the chicane alone… Lando actually loses 1 tenth against Piastri in the chicane also.

By the time they hit the chicane, Lando was matching Sainz in terms of lap time (almost identical)… And as an additional reference point, Piastri loses 1 tenth to Hamilton also at the chicane
Thank you. So it is not drag in S3, it is the chicane where car doesn't change direction well. This is what they warned about. Slow with change of direction is worse for them.

Strange that they lost time in S1 before Eau Rouge.
It's both
Image

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mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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organic wrote:
28 Jul 2023, 17:57
mwillems wrote:
28 Jul 2023, 17:55
If anyone needs any lap to understand Piastris talent and confidence, that lap in Q2 was it.
Hard to say. Piastri's suddenly looking spectacular now that Lando's car had damage. The gap would probably have been bigger between fastest McLaren and the rest if Lando had a working floor :)
From yesterday.

How about now? 😋
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

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mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:46
I was going to do a write up, but I don’t think people will waste their time reading it, lol… So instead, here is the telemetry comparison for the Sprint Shootout between the 2 McLaren drivers and the best positioned Ferrari (Caros) and Mercedes (Lewis)… A lot of interesting conclusions that could be driven from it:

https://i.imgur.com/9okCuTp.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9XMnrXY.jpg
Did you say something?

Apart from a couple of key points, Lando and Oscar are almost the same driver.
Last edited by mwillems on 29 Jul 2023, 16:37, edited 1 time in total.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

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organic
1055
Joined: 08 Jan 2022, 02:24
Location: Cambridge, UK

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 16:34
organic wrote:
28 Jul 2023, 17:57
mwillems wrote:
28 Jul 2023, 17:55
If anyone needs any lap to understand Piastris talent and confidence, that lap in Q2 was it.
Hard to say. Piastri's suddenly looking spectacular now that Lando's car had damage. The gap would probably have been bigger between fastest McLaren and the rest if Lando had a working floor :)
From yesterday.

How about now? 😋
I will eat my words and a pair of shorts to go with them!!

Fabulous work from piastri and of course the team :D hopefully the pace in the long runs is up to scratch

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mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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organic wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 16:37
mwillems wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 16:34
organic wrote:
28 Jul 2023, 17:57


Hard to say. Piastri's suddenly looking spectacular now that Lando's car had damage. The gap would probably have been bigger between fastest McLaren and the rest if Lando had a working floor :)
From yesterday.

How about now? 😋
I will eat my words and a pair of shorts to go with them!!

Fabulous work from piastri and of course the team :D hopefully the pace in the long runs is up to scratch
Ahaha nothing like a short sandwich served up cold!

We get the test run soon in the Sprint race, hopefully Oscar can navigate this well enough. And Landos Decent run in to 5th is still very good.

Sadly I'm on the beach in Madeira eating lobster and getting a tan, so please feel sorry for me when I say I will miss the race.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

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willmesquita
3
Joined: 23 Feb 2014, 20:51

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Darth-Piekus wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:13
This is off topic but after watching the F2 Sprint I can't wait to see yet another Fittipaldi in F1 and I would also love to see a Fittipaldi in the colours of Mclaren like his grandfather but that won't happen soon as we have two super fast drivers. Maybe in the distant future.
Nope. Not the best choice.
To do something well is so worthwhile that to die trying to do it better cannot be foolhardy. It would be a waste of life to do nothing with one's ability, for I feel that life is measured in achievement, not in years alone. ― Bruce McLaren

papayaorange.com.br

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
479
Joined: 10 Mar 2019, 03:54

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 16:36
SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:46
I was going to do a write up, but I don’t think people will waste their time reading it, lol… So instead, here is the telemetry comparison for the Sprint Shootout between the 2 McLaren drivers and the best positioned Ferrari (Caros) and Mercedes (Lewis)… A lot of interesting conclusions that could be driven from it:

https://i.imgur.com/9okCuTp.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9XMnrXY.jpg
Did you say something?

Apart from a couple of key points, Lando and Oscar are almost the same driver.
That’s why yesterday I said that we shouldn’t just give Lando 2 tenths “because Lando”… Having a gap so close between them is the best thing that could have happened to McLaren

FittingMechanics
FittingMechanics
16
Joined: 19 Feb 2019, 12:10

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 16:54
mwillems wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 16:36
SmallSoldier wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 15:46
I was going to do a write up, but I don’t think people will waste their time reading it, lol… So instead, here is the telemetry comparison for the Sprint Shootout between the 2 McLaren drivers and the best positioned Ferrari (Caros) and Mercedes (Lewis)… A lot of interesting conclusions that could be driven from it:

https://i.imgur.com/9okCuTp.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9XMnrXY.jpg
Did you say something?

Apart from a couple of key points, Lando and Oscar are almost the same driver.
That’s why yesterday I said that we shouldn’t just give Lando 2 tenths “because Lando”… Having a gap so close between them is the best thing that could have happened to McLaren
I have to agree. Piastri is showing he can match and beat Lando. My mistake. I thought the delta was only damage.

delayed start - team thinks 15 mins

We are losing time on the straights, but if the car could change direction in T1 and chicane (having lot of DF should help) it would be the fastest in one lap pace. In an ideal world we would have low drag but you can't have all.

FittingMechanics
FittingMechanics
16
Joined: 19 Feb 2019, 12:10

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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organic wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 17:18
FittingMechanics wrote:
29 Jul 2023, 17:06
I think this will be red flagged and cancelled.
Shouldn't be. There is a window coming when they can run the entire race without risk of more rainfall
Yeah, looks like it.

17:35 start time.

the EDGE
the EDGE
67
Joined: 13 Feb 2012, 18:31
Location: Bedfordshire ENGLAND

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Not good for Lando and others second to their teammates

Too close to double stack, better to run the lap then pit I think, which will loose time too, but probably wiser