2023 Aston Martin | Aramco | Cognizant F1 Team

[-wkst-]

I am not convinced by the article. They more or less want to say that the third pivot is responsible for the "flex wing". But the author just ignores the fact that the third pivot is only on the high DF front wing (used in Bahrain, Melbourne and Monaco) and not on the medium/low DF front wing they introduced for the 2nd race in Saudi Arabia, also used in Baku and Miami. That are just 2 different wings for different tracks. Reading the article I would believe that they tested the same wing in Saudi Arabia with or without the third pivot - but that was however not the case.

[AR3-GP]

Well there you have it....the exciting interpretation

[AR3-GP]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/aston ... /10505585/

It is understood earlier this season the FIA ramped up its analysis of various designs and expressed some unease about the construction of several front wings which it suspected could be flexing more than it felt was necessary.

Seems that autosport are reporting on this with some degree of certainty & not pulling punches with their selection of language.

Feeling like this is likely now

If anyone remembers some analysis that was done here (I forget by whom sorry) last season then a few races into 2022 Ferrari's front wing flex decreased a lot too. Could be something that FIA look at at the start of each year?

"several front wings"

oh?

[AR3-GP]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/aston ... /10505585/



Seems that autosport are reporting on this with some degree of certainty & not pulling punches with their selection of language.

Feeling like this is likely now

If anyone remembers some analysis that was done here (I forget by whom sorry) last season then a few races into 2022 Ferrari's front wing flex decreased a lot too. Could be something that FIA look at at the start of each year?

That quote from autosport kills me: 'flexing more than it felt was necessary'. It's either flexing within the limits or not, that's why there are limits and tests, they aren't feelings or ideas.

Spirit of the rules was already invoked in 2021 Re: flexible bodywork rules when the rear-wing flexibility tests were changed midseason so there is unfortunately already precedent to do this based on the FIA's whim

It was nonsense then, and it's nonsense now.

[RZS10]

If anyone remembers some analysis that was done here (I forget by whom sorry) last season then a few races into 2022 Ferrari's front wing flex decreased a lot too. Could be something that FIA look at at the start of each year?

I think you meant this:
viewtopic.php?f=12&p=1083008#p1083008
The post also has links to previous ones that were more detailed or had older wing specs.

I don't think any team had to reduce their wing flex last year, most increased it over the course of the season.

I looked into my F1 recording and the most recent FW cam i could find was the RB, so let's have a look at that, also keeping in mind how it behaved last year.

Hungary, T1 (no/low deflection) vs. end of the straight ('maximum' deflection):




Don't behead me if the markings aren't perfect, it's good enough though, the behaviour is similar to last year and probably the same on all the other cars.

If this is about wing flex the AM wing must have been doing something crazy for the FIA to clamp down, and that RB wing is already flexing and twisting quite a lot - even long after the supposed intervention.

It would also be a matter of minutes to check for the deflection on the AM wing, assuming one could find footage of different specs.

Motorsport and the other outlets say they've seen the footage, so it's kinda surprising they have not done any visual comparisons.

[AR3-GP]

Don't behead me if the markings aren't perfect, it's good enough though, the behaviour is similar to last year and probably the same on all the other cars.

If this is about wing flex the AM wing must have been doing something crazy for the FIA to clamp down, and that RB wing is already flexing and twisting quite a lot - even long after the supposed intervention.

It would also be a matter of minutes to check for the deflection on the AM wing, assuming one could find footage of different specs.

Motorsport and the other outlets say they've seen the footage, so it's kinda surprising they have not done any visual comparisons.

Someone posted an image of something that Ferrari was dinged for many years ago. It's either in this thread or the AMR23 technical thread. Perhaps that mode of deflection was present here.

[SiLo]

Don't behead me if the markings aren't perfect, it's good enough though, the behaviour is similar to last year and probably the same on all the other cars.

If this is about wing flex the AM wing must have been doing something crazy for the FIA to clamp down, and that RB wing is already flexing and twisting quite a lot - even long after the supposed intervention.

It would also be a matter of minutes to check for the deflection on the AM wing, assuming one could find footage of different specs.

Motorsport and the other outlets say they've seen the footage, so it's kinda surprising they have not done any visual comparisons.

Someone posted an image of something that Ferrari was dinged for many years ago. It's either in this thread or the AMR23 technical thread. Perhaps that mode of deflection was present here.

I posted the 2006 front wing video, where you could see the wing not only flexing down but outward too. So the wing tip moves down perpendicular to the air rushing over it, and it was pulling the upper element away from the nose, but that element clearly had a small rod it could pivot around and also move in/out from.

[AR3-GP]

Don't behead me if the markings aren't perfect, it's good enough though, the behaviour is similar to last year and probably the same on all the other cars.

If this is about wing flex the AM wing must have been doing something crazy for the FIA to clamp down, and that RB wing is already flexing and twisting quite a lot - even long after the supposed intervention.

It would also be a matter of minutes to check for the deflection on the AM wing, assuming one could find footage of different specs.

Motorsport and the other outlets say they've seen the footage, so it's kinda surprising they have not done any visual comparisons.

Someone posted an image of something that Ferrari was dinged for many years ago. It's either in this thread or the AMR23 technical thread. Perhaps that mode of deflection was present here.

I posted the 2006 front wing video, where you could see the wing not only flexing down but outward too. So the wing tip moves down perpendicular to the air rushing over it, and it was pulling the upper element away from the nose, but that element clearly had a small rod it could pivot around and also move in/out from.

Yes, in this case I'm wondering if it's the gap between the flap sections that was opening up, in addition to the drooping.

[peewon]

Whats a bit odd is how quite this whole saga has been (if its true). In previous instances, there has been a lot of public politicking over it in the media between rival teams. I wonder if thats due to AM not being in a championship fight a la Red Bull or something extremely egregious like the Ferrari fuel flow saga that AM doesnt want out there. Simple flexing is not in the latter category. Its there in every team's front wing to some degree. If it is, then its another instance of FIA picking and choosing when to enforce certain rules.

[AR3-GP]

Whats a bit odd is how quite this whole saga has been (if its true). In previous instances, there has been a lot of public politicking over it in the media between rival teams. I wonder if thats due to AM not being in a championship fight a la Red Bull or something extremely egregious like the Ferrari fuel flow saga that AM doesnt want out there. Simple flexing is not in the latter category. Its there in every team's front wing to some degree. If it is, then its another instance of FIA picking and choosing when to enforce certain rules.

I suspect a little bit of everything. They are not in the championship fight, per say. They are fighting Merc but Daimler has a small financial stake in the Aston Martin road car company so they have to be careful. They aren't troubling RB either so no real incentive for RB to be vocal.

Remember that Mercedes never pointed the finger at RB's rear wings until 2021...

[diffuser]

That quote from autosport kills me: 'flexing more than it felt was necessary'. It's either flexing within the limits or not, that's why there are limits and tests, they aren't feelings or ideas.

Spirit of the rules was already invoked in 2021 Re: flexible bodywork rules when the rear-wing flexibility tests were changed midseason so there is unfortunately already precedent to do this based on the FIA's whim

It was nonsense then, and it's nonsense now.

Yep, I remember Alpine saying that all it did was cost them $200K to replace the rear wing that wasn't any slower and in a year where the aero rule were changing completely. The rear wing would be useless after a few races.

[KimiRai]

I'll try to support Lance and say that he's not doing that bad a job as stats would initially show, he's had more bad luck than Fernando over the season plus the hand thing, though it's true that can't be an excuse forever. I hope next season he's closer from the start so there's not that big of a disparity and the team can score more points, because while Fernando should lead the team as long as he's there, it wouldn't hurt if Lance had finished more consistently in decent points.

[AR3-GP]

I'll try to support Lance and say that he's not doing that bad a job as stats would initially show, he's had more bad luck than Fernando over the season plus the hand thing, though it's true that can't be an excuse forever. I hope next season he's closer from the start so there's not that big of a disparity and the team can score more points, because while Fernando should lead the team as long as he's there, it wouldn't hurt if Lance had finished more consistently in decent points.

It does make me curious about how good last year's b-spec car actually was...and how good the 2020 car actually was....Stroll was a lot closer to Vettel and Perez.

[KimiRai]

It does make me curious about how good last year's b-spec car actually was...and how good the 2020 car actually was....Stroll was a lot closer to Vettel and Perez.

When Fernando tested the 2022 car in the postseason Abu Dhabi tests he said he was positively surprised as his expectations were lower. People originally thought his smile was more about having left Alpine and finally having a Mercedes engine by his side but later his inner cicle confirmed it was the car itself that was better than he had thought. I think he also said he couldn't understand how the team had those results with the car, though it's true he tested the B spec that was much better than the car at the start of the season.

[AR3-GP]

It does make me curious about how good last year's b-spec car actually was...and how good the 2020 car actually was....Stroll was a lot closer to Vettel and Perez.

When Fernando tested the 2022 car in the postseason Abu Dhabi tests he said he was positively surprised as his expectations were lower. People originally thought his smile was more about having left Alpine and finally having a Mercedes engine by his side but later his inner cicle confirmed it was the car itself that was better than he had thought. I think he also said he couldn't understand how the team had those results with the car, though it's true he tested the B spec that was much better than the car at the start of the season.

This confirms my suspicions right away...