2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
User avatar
BMMR61
0
Joined: 25 May 2021, 13:02
Location: Australia.

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

MCLvamos wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 00:51


The pace wasn't bad even with the compromise due to traffic and the skewed picture due to skating around in the slicks in the rain for a lap or two when other's weren't. I think the rain robbed us of a great three way fight between Russell Norris and Alonso, and I believe the pace differential would have been very small. Anyway, let's hope for a more clean (although possibly tough still) weekend at Monza!
There’s not much mention of it but Oscar had the triple calamity of
1. battling it out on slicks on wet track till it was nearly ready to intersect intermediate deltas
2 then being caught out by the difficult Magnussen and flat spotting his fronts
2. Pitting the same lap Sargeant crashed allowing the field to get a bonus pitstop
Really he had a pretty unlucky time of it and was also on pace, good enough for 3-4.

User avatar
mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

CjC wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 00:10
For me Lando talks very much in the ‘now’ and what I mean by ‘now’ is how he’s feeling at the time.
He’s feeling dejected after the race with a P7 when he was hoping for P2 knowing he had the pace for at least a P3 at Zandvoort so he’s lashing out somewhat and criticising the lack of straight line speed before he’s had his debrief with the team… he was over taking cars who had their DRS open as well as his own so the straight line speed wasn’t all that bad.

Look he might be right and there isn’t a Monza spec rear wing but that would be contrary to what Stella has said.

72 hours from now we’ll know who’s bluffing, who’s right, who’s wrong and if Chelsea are still in the EFL🤣🤣
Chelsea???! Arghhg! Hope not, from an Arsenal fan lol
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

Ground Effect
Ground Effect
14
Joined: 02 Mar 2018, 12:39

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

mwillems wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 11:07
CjC wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 00:10
For me Lando talks very much in the ‘now’ and what I mean by ‘now’ is how he’s feeling at the time.
He’s feeling dejected after the race with a P7 when he was hoping for P2 knowing he had the pace for at least a P3 at Zandvoort so he’s lashing out somewhat and criticising the lack of straight line speed before he’s had his debrief with the team… he was over taking cars who had their DRS open as well as his own so the straight line speed wasn’t all that bad.

Look he might be right and there isn’t a Monza spec rear wing but that would be contrary to what Stella has said.

72 hours from now we’ll know who’s bluffing, who’s right, who’s wrong and if Chelsea are still in the EFL🤣🤣
Chelsea???! Arghhg! Hope not, from an Arsenal fan lol
Wow! Who knew? @mwillems knows ball too... =D> 🤝 :lol:
Q: (Stefano Mancini – La Stampa) Kimi, will you help Vettel to win his championship this year?
Kimi Raikkonen: I can only drive one car, obviously. 
@2018 Singapore Grand Prix drivers press conference.

User avatar
bauc
35
Joined: 19 Jun 2013, 10:03
Location: Skopje, Macedonia

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

I watched the hole race on Sunday on mute as my son was sleeping next to me, so I did not hear what Lando was saying on the radio when it started to rain after the start of the race. Did he decided to stay out, or did the team told him to stay out? I was a HUGE mistake, HUGEEEE - It cost us an easy podium, easy! (Ok ok, it was a crazy race, anything could have happened but still...)
Формула 1 на Македонски - The first ever Macedonian Formula 1 YouTube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJkjCv ... 6rVRgKASwg

LionsHeart
LionsHeart
15
Joined: 09 Mar 2023, 19:21

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

I read an interview with Mario Isola, he said that Monza will have the softest tire sets, and also confirmed that the qualification will be held according to an updated format, where hard tires will be in the first session, medium tires in the second session and soft tires in the final. Curious how this will affect the balance of power. Previously, I remember that Pirelli brought either hard tires (though a long time ago) or medium-hard sets of tires (in Monza, of course).

MCLvamos
MCLvamos
0
Joined: 30 Jun 2023, 18:41

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

LionsHeart wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 13:00
I read an interview with Mario Isola, he said that Monza will have the softest tire sets, and also confirmed that the qualification will be held according to an updated format, where hard tires will be in the first session, medium tires in the second session and soft tires in the final. Curious how this will affect the balance of power. Previously, I remember that Pirelli brought either hard tires (though a long time ago) or medium-hard sets of tires (in Monza, of course).
Same format as Hungary then. Idk about other teams, but from McLaren's perspective shouldn't be too bad, we generally fire up our tires well and did pretty well in Hungary in Q1 & 2. If we struggle it will be a baseline issue with the car at Monza, this format shouldn't cause us too many issues.

User avatar
mclaren111
280
Joined: 06 Apr 2014, 10:49
Location: Shithole - South Africa

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

Ground Effect wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 12:07
mwillems wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 11:07
CjC wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 00:10
For me Lando talks very much in the ‘now’ and what I mean by ‘now’ is how he’s feeling at the time.
He’s feeling dejected after the race with a P7 when he was hoping for P2 knowing he had the pace for at least a P3 at Zandvoort so he’s lashing out somewhat and criticising the lack of straight line speed before he’s had his debrief with the team… he was over taking cars who had their DRS open as well as his own so the straight line speed wasn’t all that bad.

Look he might be right and there isn’t a Monza spec rear wing but that would be contrary to what Stella has said.

72 hours from now we’ll know who’s bluffing, who’s right, who’s wrong and if Chelsea are still in the EFL🤣🤣
Chelsea???! Arghhg! Hope not, from an Arsenal fan lol
Wow! Who knew? @mwillems knows ball too... =D> 🤝 :lol:

Arghhg! I think football is the most boring sport ever... :mrgreen:

Maybe seocond after basketball... :mrgreen:

User avatar
mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

MCLvamos wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 13:14
LionsHeart wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 13:00
I read an interview with Mario Isola, he said that Monza will have the softest tire sets, and also confirmed that the qualification will be held according to an updated format, where hard tires will be in the first session, medium tires in the second session and soft tires in the final. Curious how this will affect the balance of power. Previously, I remember that Pirelli brought either hard tires (though a long time ago) or medium-hard sets of tires (in Monza, of course).
Same format as Hungary then. Idk about other teams, but from McLaren's perspective shouldn't be too bad, we generally fire up our tires well and did pretty well in Hungary in Q1 & 2. If we struggle it will be a baseline issue with the car at Monza, this format shouldn't cause us too many issues.
I like that format as we have an even playing field for softs later in the race. The teams that have to try harder end up burning rubber.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

User avatar
mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

mclaren111 wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 13:24
Ground Effect wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 12:07
mwillems wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 11:07


Chelsea???! Arghhg! Hope not, from an Arsenal fan lol
Wow! Who knew? @mwillems knows ball too... =D> 🤝 :lol:

Arghhg! I think football is the most boring sport ever... :mrgreen:

Maybe seocond after basketball... :mrgreen:
Ahahaha I like Basketball too. Cricket is way more boring but I also like that!

Formula has had more than it's fair share of Boredom. Any Monaco race pretty much lives up to it plus a few others.

Monza should be super exciting.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

User avatar
MrGapes
33
Joined: 10 Mar 2021, 09:24

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

I don’t think Monza will be as bad as some might think here… I think there is far too many unknown variables coupled with the track characteristics to make a somewhat concise prediction on competitiveness. There are maybe two cornering instances on the track where we will lack to others in the race, but I think that’s overshadowed by the importance and advantage of Parabolica and Ascari. So the question mark should really be around drag (and drs effectiveness)..

This could be very very wrong but based on what I’ve seen the order could be something like Redbull > Ferrari=Mclaren > Aston=Merc

User avatar
mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

MrGapes wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:26
I don’t think Monza will be as bad as some might think here… I think there is far too many unknown variables coupled with the track characteristics to make a somewhat decisive prediction on competitiveness. There are maybe two cornering instances on the track where we will lack to others in the race, but I think that’s overshadowed by the importance and advantage of Parabolica and Ascari. So the question mark should really be around drag (and drs effectiveness)..

This could be very very wrong but based on what I’ve seen the order could be something like Redbull > Ferrari=Mclaren > Aston=Merc
It's a veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery long straight, we could easily lose up to half a second on it. I think we will make it up elsewhere a little, but not huge amounts.

Interesting point of view, plenty to talk about on Saturday!
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

MCLvamos
MCLvamos
0
Joined: 30 Jun 2023, 18:41

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

mwillems wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:28
MrGapes wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:26
I don’t think Monza will be as bad as some might think here… I think there is far too many unknown variables coupled with the track characteristics to make a somewhat decisive prediction on competitiveness. There are maybe two cornering instances on the track where we will lack to others in the race, but I think that’s overshadowed by the importance and advantage of Parabolica and Ascari. So the question mark should really be around drag (and drs effectiveness)..

This could be very very wrong but based on what I’ve seen the order could be something like Redbull > Ferrari=Mclaren > Aston=Merc
It's a veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery long straight, we could easily lose up to half a second on it. I think we will make it up elsewhere a little, but not huge amounts.

Interesting point of view, plenty to talk about on Saturday!
I honestly don't think we are that draggy with the new spec tbh. If you look at Austria and Silverstone we were pretty decent when we ran similar DF configurations to the other cars. Spa is an outlier as we ran a barn door and yes we were a *little* down in Zandvoort but our wing was quite large even for that circuit and we didn't use a more efficient one due to the wet weather.

If, and this is the big if, we bring a low-drag special (possibly with the new more efficient endplate cutout philosophy) we could see decently competitive pace down the straight and our high speed cornering performance through the aforementioned corners allowing us to on balance be quick. That's my hope, as Stella has been mentioning this "urgent" work and said explicitly "we cannot go racing like this in Monza" when discussing the Spa issue. Whether they can't get a wing ready in time and do go racing like that again remains to be seen.

User avatar
mclaren111
280
Joined: 06 Apr 2014, 10:49
Location: Shithole - South Africa

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

mwillems wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:05
mclaren111 wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 13:24
Ground Effect wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 12:07


Wow! Who knew? @mwillems knows ball too... =D> 🤝 :lol:

Arghhg! I think football is the most boring sport ever... :mrgreen:

Maybe seocond after basketball... :mrgreen:
Ahahaha I like Basketball too. Cricket is way more boring but I also like that!

Formula has had more than it's fair share of Boredom. Any Monaco race pretty much lives up to it plus a few others.

Monza should be super exciting.

Each to his own... :D Enjoy it all... :D :D

User avatar
mwillems
44
Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

MCLvamos wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:34
mwillems wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:28
MrGapes wrote:
29 Aug 2023, 14:26
I don’t think Monza will be as bad as some might think here… I think there is far too many unknown variables coupled with the track characteristics to make a somewhat decisive prediction on competitiveness. There are maybe two cornering instances on the track where we will lack to others in the race, but I think that’s overshadowed by the importance and advantage of Parabolica and Ascari. So the question mark should really be around drag (and drs effectiveness)..

This could be very very wrong but based on what I’ve seen the order could be something like Redbull > Ferrari=Mclaren > Aston=Merc
It's a veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery long straight, we could easily lose up to half a second on it. I think we will make it up elsewhere a little, but not huge amounts.

Interesting point of view, plenty to talk about on Saturday!
I honestly don't think we are that draggy with the new spec tbh. If you look at Austria and Silverstone we were pretty decent when we ran similar DF configurations to the other cars. Spa is an outlier as we ran a barn door and yes we were a *little* down in Zandvoort but our wing was quite large even for that circuit and we didn't use a more efficient one due to the wet weather.

If, and this is the big if, we bring a low-drag special (possibly with the new more efficient endplate cutout philosophy) we could see decently competitive pace down the straight and our high speed cornering performance through the aforementioned corners allowing us to on balance be quick. That's my hope, as Stella has been mentioning this "urgent" work and said explicitly "we cannot go racing like this in Monza" when discussing the Spa issue. Whether they can't get a wing ready in time and do go racing like that again remains to be seen.
The drag is only partly from the wing, even with the new wing we are going to not be especially fast. Williams could well be a threat here.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

-Bandit

LionsHeart
LionsHeart
15
Joined: 09 Mar 2023, 19:21

Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

Post

Interesting thoughts people. I just realized for myself that I definitely won’t be able to draw any adequate conclusions until I see the rear wing and how the first two practices go. :D

Yes, in 2020 and 2021 we had a super-efficient straight-line chassis, but then we lost a lot in corners. In the last year and a half, we mostly lose in long slow corners, as before, but now we also limp on straight lines. Why am I so unsure, because I have no idea what the team will bring. And to what extent it can be put to good use. If it wasn't for a rainy weekend at Spa where the team bet on more down pressure, I would have had a better idea of ​​how well the team was able to implement a rear wing with a clipped top flap, plus there was also the option of using a less loaded beam wing.

I think there is not one here who believes that the team sometimes acts very conservatively. At the same time, I also understand that they know better, because they test a variety of options on the simulator and experiment. Out of 6-7 options, two will be chosen as the most effective and brought to the track to make the final choice.

I would also like to revisit the practice in Hungary, where the team found some specific settings, plus experimental details, to get more peak downforce. They really found it and quickly discovered that the car was starting to hit the bottom.

It turns out that the team needs to add more downforce from the bottom so that they can use wings with less loading without penalty. But my guess is that they still need to rework the chassis balance and handling in slow corners, and that's just through the suspension and steering.

Reading and delving into the words of Andrea Stella, I understand that they themselves would like to use wings with less loading without penalty for themselves, but then they lose a lot not only at the exit of corners, but also in the stability of the chassis during braking. Lando lost a lot in relation to Yuki precisely in long slow turns, but before that he was extremely fast in the first sector and it was clear that Yuki could not keep up Lando's pace, but then two consecutive slow turns and Lando loses so much that he is already catching up only towards the end of the straight, and there the time is up, it's time to slow down and turn. And so circle after circle.

Perhaps this is the main reason why I do not want to review this race again. I am sure that in the future the team will be more flexible in their approach to strategy and more likely to experiment and take risks.

About Monza: I'm ready for a tough weekend. Then I won't have a reason to be upset. :) Do not judge strictly. This is just my opinion.