2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[ringo]

The new floor will be a nice little vision into what the team understands. I do wonder if Allison is downplaying how much the floor means to the team and how much track time it's worth.
If the floor doesnt work mercedes will be in it's darkest of days going forward. If it works then light would be shed on what's the best philosophy going forward and what to focus on.
They still will be clueless on the mechanical side however. How will LH desired driver position impact dynamics? Only winter testing can answer that. Though LH has a point if we look on the redbull and the mclaren.

[organic]

Antonelli is doing f2 next year already. Skipping F3 entirely, despite not completely dominating freca

Considering Hamilton is sticking around for at least until the end of 2026, what are they rushing Antonelli for? There will be at least 3 more seasons until the possibility of a Merc seat opens

It could end up in a bit of a mess

He is dominating FRECA. F2 is right for him given the new cars are coming in.

Have you been watching? Stenshorn was very close to Antonelli until a couple of races ago after which he has had a strong of messy weekends/bad results making things look dominant. Their pace was similar for most of he year and I wouldn't say Antonelli has had a dominant season

[Henri]

W15 needs to find 1sec or 8 tenths to compete with redbull.. McLaren found 1.4 sec in upgrades

In response to the tweet or X, or whatever it goes by these days, It has to match because points are determined by finishing order which is determined by pace.

I think mercedes need to find half a second more than what can be gleaned from race statistics. Max is rarely pushing. The pace is being managed 80% of the time. When I see the RB19 slide all over the track and locking up thats when i beleive I am seeing it's ultimate pace.

True they need to find 1.5 to a sec because the rb20 will improve on the rb19 and the rb19 has no weakness at all lol

[Henri]

The ferrari rumors where true .. i think 2026 if Mercedes are not competitive.. ferrari and ashton i good options i want for him

Yes this is much more than what I imagined. Dinner with Elkann? Hamilton was certainly curious...

LH is a valuable brand ambassador for Merc for sure the team will want him to retire at Merc instead of Ferrari.
The fact that LH signed a 2-year contract means he has an option for 2026. There is no such thing as loyalty in F1, its all about money and championship.

Seeing how Marc Márquez quit Honda to join Ducati's 2nd team, I am sure LH will be thinking of the same in 2026.

As a Lewis finishing his career at McLaren and winning a championship there is a dream

[PlatinumZealot]

I rather him movet to Ferrari to be honest! McLaren has a nice nostalgic feel, but there was a dark side to his time there.

[Cs98]

Antonelli is doing f2 next year already. Skipping F3 entirely, despite not completely dominating freca

Considering Hamilton is sticking around for at least until the end of 2026, what are they rushing Antonelli for? There will be at least 3 more seasons until the possibility of a Merc seat opens

It could end up in a bit of a mess

He is dominating FRECA. F2 is right for him given the new cars are coming in.

Have you been watching? Stenshorn was very close to Antonelli until a couple of races ago after which he has had a strong of messy weekends/bad results making things look dominant. Their pace was similar for most of he year and I wouldn't say Antonelli has had a dominant season

Stenshorn was very close to Antonelli until a couple of races ago after which he has had a strong of messy weekends/bad results making things look dominant

This way of thinking is a fallacy IMO. Look at the complete picture, not parts of the season. Antonelli has comfortably won the championship with a couple of races to go. The cream always rises over a larger sample size, consistency is the most important trait of a strong driver. His title clinching race today was a masterclass in the wet, miles ahead of second. And he could've won it sooner, he lost a win after being demoted 10 places in Monza.

Promoting him to F2 is the correct decision IMO. Completely new cars, thus previous experience has less value. He doesn't need to be a one and done guy in F2. Two years is reasonable (unless he wins in his first), then on to Williams, then Merc. He'll be a consideration for the Merc seat in 2026 at the earliest, more likely 2027. If Lewis hasn't won his championship by that point he never will.

[ringo]

W15 needs to find 1sec or 8 tenths to compete with redbull.. McLaren found 1.4 sec in upgrades

In response to the tweet or X, or whatever it goes by these days, It has to match because points are determined by finishing order which is determined by pace.

I think mercedes need to find half a second more than what can be gleaned from race statistics. Max is rarely pushing. The pace is being managed 80% of the time. When I see the RB19 slide all over the track and locking up thats when i beleive I am seeing it's ultimate pace.

True they need to find 1.5 to a sec because the rb20 will improve on the rb19 and the rb19 has no weakness at all lol

Make that 2 seconds then. Max was saying that the rb19 has a few weaknesses and things he would change. I think next year the rb20 will be more sorted in qualifying.
I do have faith in mercedes though. To be second in the constructors with a handicapped car is noteworthy.

[CHT]

RBR's advantage is not just the car, but also Max's ability and his attitude towards tweaking his driving style to get the best out of the car. For some drivers, they may insist on getting a "perfect" car before they can perform.
From the engineers' perspective. working with a driver like Max will give the team more possibilities to improve the cars.

LH can insist on copying RBR or McLaren etc, but the car may end up not suiting his driving style.

And I think this is where younger drivers may have an advantage as they have fewer things to unlearn.

[Mosin123]

RBR's advantage is not just the car, but also Max's ability and his attitude towards tweaking his driving style to get the best out of the car. For some drivers, they may insist on getting a "perfect" car before they can perform.
From the engineers' perspective. working with a driver like Max will give the team more possibilities to improve the cars.

LH can insist on copying RBR or McLaren etc, but the car may end up not suiting his driving style.

And I think this is where younger drivers may have an advantage as they have fewer things to unlearn.

Well, They couldnt find the perfect set up in Singapore, And neither Redbull driver had a sniff of the win, in one of the most dominate cars ever.

[j_ste]

LH can insist on copying RBR or McLaren etc, but the car may end up not suiting his driving style.

What is his driving style because mercedes have been multiple cars with differing strengths over the past decade... and he has largely managed to get the most out of all of them.

Even this current thing, which he openly hates.

Ultimately, if you have something that can win. Then its up to you...nobody wants something that is comfortable and slow. 17 years of doing this thing, I think he has proven he knows what to do with a winning package

[Hammerfist]

RBR's advantage is not just the car, but also Max's ability and his attitude towards tweaking his driving style to get the best out of the car. For some drivers, they may insist on getting a "perfect" car before they can perform.
From the engineers' perspective. working with a driver like Max will give the team more possibilities to improve the cars.

LH can insist on copying RBR or McLaren etc, but the car may end up not suiting his driving style.

And I think this is where younger drivers may have an advantage as they have fewer things to unlearn.

I am personally not a fan of being just a RBR copy. I'm a strong believer in that if you copy you will always be second. I hope they have something creative and productive in mind and not just blindly listen to what Hamilton is saying. Someone should whisper to Lewis what happened to the Racing Point of 2020 and the Aston Martin of this year. Both near carbon copies of the best cars in their respective fields and both only relegated to second best and fading as the season progressed.

[CHT]

RBR's advantage is not just the car, but also Max's ability and his attitude towards tweaking his driving style to get the best out of the car. For some drivers, they may insist on getting a "perfect" car before they can perform.
From the engineers' perspective. working with a driver like Max will give the team more possibilities to improve the cars.

LH can insist on copying RBR or McLaren etc, but the car may end up not suiting his driving style.

And I think this is where younger drivers may have an advantage as they have fewer things to unlearn.

I am personally not a fan of being just a RBR copy. I'm a strong believer in that if you copy you will always be second. I hope they have something creative and productive in mind and not just blindly listen to what Hamilton is saying. Someone should whisper to Lewis what happened to the Racing Point of 2020 and the Aston Martin of this year. Both near carbon copies of the best cars in their respective fields and both only relegated to second best and fading as the season progressed.

All the top teams in F1 have pretty much the same level of resources, brain power, funding and capability to become champions. Just because Mer won 8 WCCs in a row it doesn't mean they have a monopoly to become champions. 2022 and 2023 is a real tests for the team, and I think it will be a tall order to expect Merc to turn up in 2024 with a new car to compete for a championship.

[AR3-GP]

COTA is another Hamilton track. Could be a podium with the floor upgrade which James Allison is trying to downplay...

[Stu]

LH can insist on copying RBR or McLaren etc, but the car may end up not suiting his driving style.

What is his driving style because mercedes have been multiple cars with differing strengths over the past decade... and he has largely managed to get the most out of all of them.

Even this current thing, which he openly hates.

Ultimately, if you have something that can win. Then its up to you...nobody wants something that is comfortable and slow. 17 years of doing this thing, I think he has proven he knows what to do with a winning package

If the current car was setting the pace (or if there was no MV - see the alternative championship thread…), would this car be ‘hated’, or would it just be considered to be another ‘diva’???

[ValeVida46]

If the current car was setting the pace (or if there was no MV - see the alternative championship thread…), would this car be ‘hated’, or would it just be considered to be another ‘diva’???

What motivation would lead a mod to make this comment?