2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:20
grubschumi13 wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:15
The cars were very close with RBR the 3rd fastest but Max managed his tires better than anyone.
I am also not confident yet Max can still win it. But I almost never have super big up front confidence. Max thinks he has about 0.3 0.4 on the others, but he is unsure if that is enough delta to make a move. I had hoped for Perez to come more through the field today and that wasn’t really happening.

Might be a very good race tomorrow.
His unusually shaped "violin plot" shows Max is not telling the truth. Naturally it should be elongated to account for wear, track rubberizing in and fuel burn-off. Instead we are looking at a deliberately truncated chart. He has a second in his back pocket if he really pushed.
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avantman
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:31
His unusually shaped "violin plot" shows Max is not telling the truth. Naturally it should be elongated to account for wear, track rubberizing in and fuel burn-off. Instead we are looking at a deliberately truncated chart. He has a second in his back pocket if he really pushed.
Two at very least. (probably two and a half)

AR3-GP
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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avantman wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:33
PlatinumZealot wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:31
His unusually shaped "violin plot" shows Max is not telling the truth. Naturally it should be elongated to account for wear, track rubberizing in and fuel burn-off. Instead we are looking at a deliberately truncated chart. He has a second in his back pocket if he really pushed.
Two at very least. (probably two and a half)
Rb would love to have such a margin :lol: :lol:
A lion must kill its prey.

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ringo
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:05
chrisc90 wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 00:52
Still plenty of pace in hand in the red bull of Max. Cruising. Be interesting to pull up the lap times. He did some PU assessment on the last lap and was 1-2seconds faster than most according to commentators.
He had saved tires from lap1. Even when Lewis was still in DRS he already took the strain out of the corners while Lewis was still hugging the inside.

I think Lewis, Norris, Max are the contenders. Max has to pass a lot of people. You could see from Sainz it can be hard. Tracklimits are close here too when the move is marginal.
Judging by Perez closing speed on those he overtook.. Max will be up to P-2 by lap 10.. P-1 by lap 15.
For Sure!!

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ringo
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:20
grubschumi13 wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:15
The cars were very close with RBR the 3rd fastest but Max managed his tires better than anyone.
I am also not confident yet Max can still win it. But I almost never have super big up front confidence. Max thinks he has about 0.3 0.4 on the others, but he is unsure if that is enough delta to make a move. I had hoped for Perez to come more through the field today and that wasn’t really happening.

Might be a very good race tomorrow.
The cars are fueled for just 19 laps. When a full race distance of fuel is put in, there will be a bigger pace difference between redbull and the others. Don't worry. 1 second a lap gap will exist tomorrow.
Max put on the jets on Hamilton today and was quite comfortable.
For Sure!!

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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I'm willing to bet Russell and Sainz will start on softs tomorrow. This proved quite effective in ruining Norris's race. It could work to delay Verstappen. Perez in P6 today was 10 seconds off the lead after 3 laps.
A lion must kill its prey.

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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Pirelli's list isn't up yet, but those should normally be the tires left for the race:

Image

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Sieper
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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ringo wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 02:00
Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:20
grubschumi13 wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:15
The cars were very close with RBR the 3rd fastest but Max managed his tires better than anyone.
I am also not confident yet Max can still win it. But I almost never have super big up front confidence. Max thinks he has about 0.3 0.4 on the others, but he is unsure if that is enough delta to make a move. I had hoped for Perez to come more through the field today and that wasn’t really happening.

Might be a very good race tomorrow.
The cars are fueled for just 19 laps. When a full race distance of fuel is put in, there will be a bigger pace difference between redbull and the others. Don't worry. 1 second a lap gap will exist tomorrow.
Max put on the jets on Hamilton today and was quite comfortable.
I hope you are right, Max seemed confident post sprint but there also was a factor of not knowing for sure. He talked about 0.3 0.4. The second (or even more) in a lap is from when he was really pushing like he did towards the end when indeed the tires still had it. But I think both Lewis and Charles were not taking any risks anymore. Sprints usually fizzle out as everyone is on the same strategy.

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Sieper
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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search wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 08:56
Pirelli's list isn't up yet, but those should normally be the tires left for the race:

https://i.imgur.com/s3M9TcO.png
Norris and Piastri have got two hards left. That is diverging from most other teams.

Cs98
Cs98
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:31
Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:20
grubschumi13 wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 01:15
The cars were very close with RBR the 3rd fastest but Max managed his tires better than anyone.
I am also not confident yet Max can still win it. But I almost never have super big up front confidence. Max thinks he has about 0.3 0.4 on the others, but he is unsure if that is enough delta to make a move. I had hoped for Perez to come more through the field today and that wasn’t really happening.

Might be a very good race tomorrow.
His unusually shaped "violin plot" shows Max is not telling the truth. Naturally it should be elongated to account for wear, track rubberizing in and fuel burn-off. Instead we are looking at a deliberately truncated chart. He has a second in his back pocket if he really pushed.
Naturally that makes no sense, the factors you mention work opposite one another. Track improvement and fuel burn combat wear. So if you have good wear it's perfectly possible to maintain roughly the same pace throughout the whole stint. Pushing hard early (like LH) will not gain you time over the entire stint, a measured effort is the fastest.

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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 10:07
search wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 08:56
Pirelli's list isn't up yet, but those should normally be the tires left for the race:

https://i.imgur.com/s3M9TcO.png
Norris and Piastri have got two hards left. That is diverging from most other teams.
yeah, but not sure it really is an advantage, as McLaren's degradation looked fine in the sprint, especially considering that they started the race on 5 lap old mediums. Could even be a one-stopper today, and then a new medium in the pits would probably be the better option in case of a late SC

FittingMechanics
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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search wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 10:19
Sieper wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 10:07
search wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 08:56
Pirelli's list isn't up yet, but those should normally be the tires left for the race:

https://i.imgur.com/s3M9TcO.png
Norris and Piastri have got two hards left. That is diverging from most other teams.
yeah, but not sure it really is an advantage, as McLaren's degradation looked fine in the sprint, especially considering that they started the race on 5 lap old mediums. Could even be a one-stopper today, and then a new medium in the pits would probably be the better option in case of a late SC
It does seem McLaren expected more wear. Still it shouldn't be that big of an issue.

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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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FittingMechanics wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 10:51
It does seem McLaren expected more wear. Still it shouldn't be that big of an issue.
yeah, normally not.

Tire behaviour will be interesting in general, though, as they seemed to get back to life after a couple of bad laps for some (Albon, Sainz, Hülkenberg) yesterday, but not everyone. Doesn't make pit calls easy.

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Wouter
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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Its a shame that we already saw in the Sprintrace who can handle his tires well and who not.
The whole race is about tire management.

Everyone drove with the Medium and only Saiz with the Soft which he did very well!
Max had almost no degradation and was allowed to push the second half of the race.
Perez was again very slow compared to Max and had more tire degradation.
Norris did very well and had almost no tire degradation.
Leclerc had as usual a high tire degradation.

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Re: 2023 United States Grand Prix - COTA, Oct 20 - 22

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Wouter wrote:
22 Oct 2023, 11:12
Leclerc had as usual a high tire degradation.
I wouldn't really say "as usual" anymore. Since Zandvoort, Ferrari has had far less problems with degradation than before.