Concept power units from 2030

[Ferry]

Wait a second. I'm down with deleting 100% of the driver controls beyond steering, shifting, brake balance and differential control.

I'd argue gear changing is not about driver skill. It's due to shortcomings of the RPM-range of the engine. One pedal for accelleration +/- and a steering wheel is all you need. Or maybe a separate pedal for braking. Everything else is "Nintendo".

[Zynerji]

... Any tool that allows the driver to have direct control of mid-corner car balancing are exactly what I feel should be added. Then it becomes skill, and not automated.

aeroplane drivers have been doing this for 100 years ie differential braking (also differential throttling)

it seems implausible to use one MG via some weird, complicated and wasteful mechanical variable differential .....
when two (smaller) independent MGs could be used without any mechanical differential
signal arithmetic ie summing & differencing small voltages is far better than summing and differencing actual forces

Nissan Juke AWD rear diff does it... Its not beyond the F1 teams ability. I think it would even be legal under current rules as the driver already has the ability to change the diff settings. it would just be moving them to a digital-proportional trigger instead of a turn-knob.

[Tommy Cookers]

Nissan Juke AWD rear diff does it... Its not beyond the F1 teams ability. I think it would even be legal under current rules as the driver already has the ability to change the diff settings. it would just be moving them to a digital-proportional trigger instead of a turn-knob.

that 'L.S.D' is just an active fiddle brake
(manual fiddle brakes were/are eg a key part of trials driving UK-style)

it works by wasting energy

[Cold Fussion]

it seems implausible to use one MG via some weird, complicated and wasteful mechanical variable differential .....
when two (smaller) independent MGs could be used without any mechanical differential
signal arithmetic ie summing & differencing small voltages is far better than summing and differencing actual forces

That's the argument Lucid make for their double rear MG as well.

[Zynerji]

Nissan Juke AWD rear diff does it... Its not beyond the F1 teams ability. I think it would even be legal under current rules as the driver already has the ability to change the diff settings. it would just be moving them to a digital-proportional trigger instead of a turn-knob.

that 'L.S.D' is just an active fiddle brake
(manual fiddle brakes were/are eg a key part of trials driving UK-style)

it works by wasting energy

The electromagnetic, torque vectoring differential that I used as an example is NOT a LSD...

And splitting between 50/50 and 0/100 doesn't seem to be much of an energy waste. (some I'm sure, but minimal if you compare the AWD vs FWD mpg statistics)

[Tommy Cookers]

Nissan Juke AWD rear diff does it... Its not beyond the F1 teams ability. I think it would even be legal under current rules as the driver already has the ability to change the diff settings. it would just be moving them to a digital-proportional trigger instead of a turn-knob.

that 'L.S.D' is just an active fiddle brake
(manual fiddle brakes were/are eg a key part of trials driving UK-style)
it works by wasting energy

The electromagnetic, torque vectoring differential that I used as an example is NOT a LSD...
And splitting between 50/50 and 0/100 doesn't seem to be much of an energy waste. (some I'm sure, but minimal if you compare the AWD vs FWD mpg statistics)

you wrote Nissan Juke AWD
so I looked at Nissan Juke AWD

did you mean Nissan Juke AWD-V ?
(yes there is such a thing)

[Zynerji]

that 'L.S.D' is just an active fiddle brake
(manual fiddle brakes were/are eg a key part of trials driving UK-style)
it works by wasting energy

The electromagnetic, torque vectoring differential that I used as an example is NOT a LSD...
And splitting between 50/50 and 0/100 doesn't seem to be much of an energy waste. (some I'm sure, but minimal if you compare the AWD vs FWD mpg statistics)

you wrote Nissan Juke AWD
so I looked at Nissan Juke AWD

did you mean Nissan Juke AWD-V ?
(yes there is such a thing)

I that the vector one?

On a technical forum, I never seem to expect these kinds of questions as even a partial attempt at critical thinking would normally yield an obvious answer.

[DenBommer]

My dream concept would be for the FIA to do something similar to what Mate Rimac did with Bugatti.

A naturally aspirated V8 engine, although it will probably end up being turbocharged so it doesn’t sound too loud for newer fans nowadays, combined with two MGU-Ks, one on the front axle and one on the rear axle.

I am a bit concerned, however, that a front MGU-K would make the nose much wider.

[Tommy Cookers]

... Any tool that allows the driver to have direct control of mid-corner car balancing are exactly what I feel should be added. Then it becomes skill, and not automated.

this suggests a desire to use significantly the differential driving only the outer wheel (as Juke in AWD-V 0/100 mode)

how is this control 'balancing' ie proportionate ?
the driver or his control would need be 'fiddling' the 'V' function on/off
(Nissan's competitors get the desired outcome via intelligent automatic brake 'fiddling' and a conventional diff)

is this 'V' control capability intended to be additional to the F1-conventional differential - or to replace it ?
wouldn't switching between eg 65/35 and 50/50 and 35/65 be better ?
(or a bit of electrical energy in or out via gears would give torque distribution proportionate to driver control)

[Zynerji]

... Any tool that allows the driver to have direct control of mid-corner car balancing are exactly what I feel should be added. Then it becomes skill, and not automated.

this suggests a desire to use significantly the differential driving only the outer wheel (as Juke in AWD-V 0/100 mode)

how is this control 'balancing' ie proportionate ?
the driver or his control would need be 'fiddling' the 'V' function on/off
(Nissan's competitors get the desired outcome via intelligent automatic brake 'fiddling' and a conventional diff)

is this 'V' control capability intended to be additional to the F1-conventional differential - or to replace it ?
wouldn't switching between eg 65/35 and 50/50 and 35/65 be better ?
(or a bit of electrical energy in or out via gears would give torque distribution proportionate to driver control)

I'm a hard no on electric motors at all. we have Formula E for that. Unless they move to MGU-H turbos on a Rocket Exhaust as a closed loop generator for wheel motors. then it would sound epic.

And the differential is pretty easy to understand. in normal position of the wheel triggers, both left and right are engaged at 100% (so, 50/50 split). Each trigger can reduce from 100-0 based on its position. No preset, computer controlled, automated "diff magic". Just a driver being in control of both the front and rear axle without intervention.