2026 Aston Martin Aramco Formula One Team

[zoroastar]

Kind of strange from what we're used to. With the front a rear wings flatting out in the straights is anybody bringing skinny wings to Monza ?

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theres been some talk that the way that the "low downforce" areas have been mapped out that there would be less pure low df setups. it was just speculation until now though.

[mzso]

What do you think? AM´s car is better than Alpine´s but the engine deficit is HUGE. As I said before, try to work out a deal with Red Bull, ffs

They don't need to work out a deal with RB. The manufacturer with the least teams is obligated to supply engines. New suppliers are exempt so it would be a Ferrari PU, which seems better than the Red Bull.
It's all about the contract with Honda, whether they need to or want to stick with them. Somehow I don't think they can easily break this contract if they're so inclined.

I hope they stay with Honda. I hope the reason they stay is because Honda is making good progress in performance and R&D. We’ll see the results on track next year.

I wouldn't mind if they went on a one-year development sabbatical. Not sure what the regulatory implications would be though.

[Ashwinv16]

I am hoping for something similar to a Dutch GP where they found 10kmph for the race simply by having more harvest limit. But harvesting is going to be hard. The Honda engine seems to struggle in quali mode. They seem to have to lose power cause the car seems to harvest too much too early.

[zoroastar]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/what- ... hatgpt.com
Shintaro Orihara "Our engine performance is definitely poor compared to other manufacturers. So probably the most important point to improve now is our engine performance because, as I mentioned, the gap is quite huge.


I see no reason to believe that the AMR26 is any more that 1 or 2 % better or worse draggy that other cars.

Mmmm...

I guess Shintaro Orihara should have said "I - THINK"...

It kind of sucks that they haven't updated the F1 tools. It would be really interesting to see where teams are deploying electrical energy, how much and how much charge the battery has. If Drag is the problem why can't the AMR26 get to 316km/h at every straight ? It isn't drag holding it back at 302km/h in the 3ird straight.

There are basically 4 straights and he Williams is minimum 10kg heavier than the AMR26

    1st,2nd,3ird,4th
ALO 316,288,302,303
SAI 331,301,324,314

https://www.gp-tempo.com/app?year=2026& ... =telemetry

i have a suspicion that part of the reason that we dont see that stuff is that it would show how bad some engines are. and it wouldnt be a good look. also the reason why they dont tell absolute numbers in ADUO. they want to keep the manufacturers happy

[Petebass]

Honda will get there... by the end of this regulation.

I don't expect much in 2027 because the others will keep improving while Honda is still busy solving problems.

And perhaps this will be the end of Honda in F1, because who would want to sign with them under the new regulations given their recent history?

[zoroastar]

They don't need to work out a deal with RB. The manufacturer with the least teams is obligated to supply engines. New suppliers are exempt so it would be a Ferrari PU, which seems better than the Red Bull.
It's all about the contract with Honda, whether they need to or want to stick with them. Somehow I don't think they can easily break this contract if they're so inclined.

I hope they stay with Honda. I hope the reason they stay is because Honda is making good progress in performance and R&D. We’ll see the results on track next year.

I wouldn't mind if they went on a one-year development sabbatical. Not sure what the regulatory implications would be though.

this would be my dream scenario. dont see it happening though. especially if these engine rules are gonna be cut short. honda are likely to quit again when v8s take their place

[TyreSlip]

this would be my dream scenario. dont see it happening though. especially if these engine rules are gonna be cut short. honda are likely to quit again when v8s take their place

For some reason, I could see the manufacturers pushing these engine regulations beyond 2030. Too much was invested into them for only a 5-year period.

Could you imagine the additional costs if there were new regulations in 2031? Manufacturers would be developing two different power units in a few years.

[KimiRai]

This GP was going to expose the PU gap and it did exactly that. It is what we have and will be for the foreseeable future. They deserve a second chance, personally I will judge them on how they recover from now on. Any kind of misstep will bring a huge amount of pressure though. And I'm not sure Honda could go to another team like after McLaren because I don't think there is one who would want an engine, remember Red Bull was very unhappy with Renault for years, I don't see such a situation at the moment. Unless Honda buys an entire team which also seems unlikely. So Honda really needs to do well, for their own sake in F1. I certainly want them to recover and achieve success with Aston, but what I want does not matter of course.

[TyreSlip]

This GP was going to expose the PU gap and it did exactly that. It is what we have and will be for the foreseeable future. They deserve a second chance, personally I will judge them on how they recover from now on. Any kind of misstep will bring a huge amount of pressure though. And I'm not sure Honda could go to another team like after McLaren because I don't think there is one who would want an engine, remember Red Bull was very unhappy with Renault for years, I don't see such a situation at the moment. Unless Honda buys an entire team which also seems unlikely. So Honda really needs to do well, for their own sake in F1. I certainly want them to recover and achieve success with Aston, but what I want does not matter of course.

Contrary to what some posters may think, Aston Martin fans want Honda to succeed and make a comeback next year.

[diffuser]

This GP was going to expose the PU gap and it did exactly that. It is what we have and will be for the foreseeable future. They deserve a second chance, personally I will judge them on how they recover from now on. Any kind of misstep will bring a huge amount of pressure though. And I'm not sure Honda could go to another team like after McLaren because I don't think there is one who would want an engine, remember Red Bull was very unhappy with Renault for years, I don't see such a situation at the moment. Unless Honda buys an entire team which also seems unlikely. So Honda really needs to do well, for their own sake in F1. I certainly want them to recover and achieve success with Aston, but what I want does not matter of course.

Contrary to what some posters may think, Aston Martin fans want Honda to succeed and make a comeback next year.

Agreed.

[venkyhere]

At this point in the season, I very much doubt that.


If we are playing that game, I am sure thet the common consensus is that the rear wing creates the most drag, up to a third of the total drag in past generations of cars. So I challenge that 1-2 combo, as much as I challenge looking at the drag on any one element in isolation.

That quote is, again, assumptions, unbased guesses stated as fact, and opinion. Would it be so hard to add "IMO" or "I think" here and there. Do you think it makes your argument weaker somehow?

If the whole point of that is to say that the car is not draggy (read not draggier than the others) because the wings can flatten out, that is missing the forest for one particular tree. That wing can still be graggier when flattened compared to the others, plus every other part of the car can be draggier than the others, including the whole setup (rake anyone?) of the car. Newey does not have a penchant for producing the draggiest car in the field, not at all /sarcasm off/.

You can not conclude that the car is not a drag monster compared to the others (neither can I conclude the opposite). Let´s remember what we don't know and the extremely thick fog of war, please. We - don't - know!

That's useful time from your life spent on a thread that simply refuses to stick to the 'one thing' than an engineering-based-sport clearly makes 'relative performance' across competitors easy to judge - MEASURABLE UNITS. There is more phrases like 'my feeling says' , 'I dont think X or Y.. is responsible.' , 'I FEEL it's DEFINITELY engine/chassis/weight, even though I have no data' etc, in this thread, than one would find in a similar team thread in a football forum where people argue over 'what formation is best' (which isn't even 'measurable').

This thread seems more like a place where 'one set of feelings' goes to argue with 'another set of feelings' , instead of 'data inference A' pitted against 'data inference B'.

Please allow me the opportunity and the time to answer your post !!

So you are coming from a technical/engineering background, we get that.

You are frustrated when not engineering people come to the technical threads of this forum saying something not too technical and you down vote them on reputation. We can see that in your reputation history.

Then you come here to the AMR team thread to write what your just wrote.

Let me tell you how I see things!!

Yes this forum is called F1technical, BUT.. over the years this forum has involved to something much greater than this. It has involved in a place for people that love and follows F1 for many many years, to be able to express themselves and tell their opinion about anything is f1 related.
It’s a global F1 community and i am guessing (not sure), that by now, the not technical/engineering part of this community is bigger that the actual technical/engineering part.

Now lets speak about the engineering part of this forum and if all the other aspects of this forum are irrelevant or not.

Even in an an engineering-based-sport as you said, relative performance IS NOT always easy to judge. It may be easy to WITNESS yes, but is never easy to judge !! I don’t know if your tech-savvy character understands this.
Relative performance & measurable units in f1 gives us an estimation on how and why, but never gives us the actual facts or the absolute truth.

The fact (on many things in f1) is that we actually DO NOT now !!
We speculate, yes, analyze, yes, but especially this year with the complexity of the power deliver among internal combustion, harvesting and electrical deployment, the fact is that we just don’t know.
If you ask me, even other F1 teams that have access on much more data, especially regarding gps data and analysis, some things, well, they just don’t know for sure. We don’t know, because even if we have some data to analyze we never have them all.

Let’s take the DRAG situation regarding AMR for example. Please Tell us !!! how “a data inference A” pitted against 'data inference B' shows your tech-savvy mind that AMR is draggy, or not draggy, without knowing all the engine parameters ,meaning ICE & ERS parameters and data (IC power, clipping & harvesting in general).

Have no illusions my friend !! being an engineer, either engine engineer or aerodynamicist or what ever, doesn’t mean you have a better understating of F1 than me or others in this forum.

Lets say you are an engineer (engine, aerodynamicist or whatever) and I am a data analyst that follows F1 since early 90s. You think you are more fitted in this forum than me (or others like me)?? You think you understand F1 better than us ?? just because you understand how air flows over the car, or how brakes or suspension works??

I am an analyst and I don’t care how brakes work, or how air flows, I just care about how brakes perform and how the aero performs, because if have that set of data I can get to analyze them and get to conclusions.
All I care about is sets of data and information !! You thing me or some of us watching a race with one tv and 2 tablets in front of us, following live timing and on board radio of our “Driver of Interest” coms, have an inferior opinion about how things work in f1, and how a race progresses??

I don’t want to break it for you mate, but F1 strategists for examble nowadays are more mathematics and statistics-oriented than technical and engineering oriented!!
They don’t actually care how brakes or aero work for example they only care about performance data. Data they can analyze and come to conclusions!!

Yes some of us are biased or fans of a team or a driver but that does not make us lesser in any sort. Lets take me for example, I am a Mclaren fan, and Alonso fan which happens to be an IT engineer and data analysts that follows F1 since early 90s. I can spend hours analyzing a “Race of interest” or a “Driver of interest” rewatching onboards, radio coms and live timings just to be able to debate someone here in this forum.

This is, who I am so tell me.. do you thing my input is irrelevant? I remind you that you are not in the technical part of this forum right now !!

Tells us what you think !!

Your post kind of proves the point I was making.

I have no objection, neither do I reply to, posts which don't interest me - we are all different, and each of us have a choice to skip posts, or to respond. In fact, I haven't posted in this thread for a long time. I was just responding to the Moderator, who was trying to say "hey, stop posting wild guesses as facts" because that's what's been happening in this thread since the start of the season, very consistently. It's become a 'facebook wall to vent' where 'what exactly could be the reason for deficit' is less important than 'who is to blame for the deficit'. I wuouldn't even have typed this reply, but I didn't want to ignore the multiple 'tell me/us' prompts in your post.

PS : upvote/downvote doesn't happen in team threads, they happen in car-threads/engg-focussed threads (which is a world you probably avoid) where we mark posts +1/-1 based on science, not emotion (I have gotten so many negative votes, and it hasn't made me lose sleep, because it's just a 'vote', it's not a bank account).

[peewon]

I hope they stay with Honda. I hope the reason they stay is because Honda is making good progress in performance and R&D. We’ll see the results on track next year.

They cannot possibly close the gap by next year. Its too big. It would be an amazing acheivement if they can do it in 2 years. If AM has any ambition of contending even for individual wins or podiums on a regular basis in the next 2 years, it wont happen with Honda. Honda themselves have put timeline to compete by the year after next in the most optimistic scenario. And Im not convinced by their self awareness based on how its gone so far.

[V10FURY]

Very happy for Gasly getting his first pole position after so many years in F1. Monza is a power track, and even the mid field Alpine car with the best PU package can get pole. What can Aston Martin do with a better chassis than Alpine and the newly upgraded Honda PU? Last and not even close to Cadillac here because the Honda PU is pathetic. I was hoping that 3 practice sessions and dialing in this engine would unlock the promised 30hp power upgrade and drivability fixes. This engine package is so far off the rest of the competitors it is time to be honest here. Next year will also be a disaster if this upgrade was the design direction Honda went towards. People saying the car is draggy are not being serious with the speed differential here. It is all down to the engine power, harvesting and deployment around a single lap. Honda has failed the team, and the team needs to respond quickly to this mess, and not just accept it like some posters here are. Why isn’t Honda using a second token ADOU upgrade this season? The team waited 5 months for Hondas upgrade package and this is all they got. That’s simply not good enough at this level.

Lawrence Stroll needs to get a new engine supplier for 2028 at the latest, as this team will be bankrupt by running Honda again in 2027. They will not catch up, and probably won’t stick around for the V8 formula anyway, so time to get a new supplier. Mercedes, RBT or Audi in that order and preferably for next year if possible. Who cares if Hondas feelings are hurt, they didn’t take this challenge seriously enough, and shouldn’t be treated with kid gloves.

I can agree the chassis was bad at the start because of many factors, including Newey coming on board late and changing things dramatically when he did. The high rake aero concept has not worked out and the team had to scramble to change direction. But we must also agree that the team got next to zero miles in testing across 2 cars compared to the competition because of the Honda engine and batteries. This was a team failure of course, but Honda showing up with a dog of an engine that is unreliable and vibrating the car to pieces certainly destroyed this teams chances of dialing in the chassis in preseason. The chassis upgrades have worked, and the direction is now good with more work to be done to catch the lead 4 teams.

The FIA has decided these engines are so diabolically bad they must shorten the races by 5% next year so teams don’t need to redo the fuel tanks and chassis. That should be a green light now to ditch Honda and go with a different supplier asap. Unless Honda are going to help with a huge sum of money, Aston should break this supplier deal. If Aston is 10th in the constructors championship two years in a row, they will loose millions in prize money and good sponsors very quickly. It will be financially damaging to the road car brand in perception as well. Is that worth continuing with Honda until they can get closer to the top engine suppliers in 3-4 years? No wonder Alonso is not signing anything yet. Why would he want to waste another year at the back of the grid in 2027.

[etusch]

I am hoping for something similar to a Dutch GP where they found 10kmph for the race simply by having more harvest limit. But harvesting is going to be hard. The Honda engine seems to struggle in quali mode. They seem to have to lose power cause the car seems to harvest too much too early.

Same here. They don't have peak power but in race trim, still behind but not that bad. This long straights only merc looks good, I will put audi to second.

There aren't chance for change for a race. But long straights and very high RPMs are something the electric motor wouldn't like very much ( in fact not motor but battery). How does it work to reach a certain speed as quickly as possible and then maintain it with ICE?

[Sedaxel]

This GP was going to expose the PU gap and it did exactly that. It is what we have and will be for the foreseeable future. They deserve a second chance, personally I will judge them on how they recover from now on. Any kind of misstep will bring a huge amount of pressure though. And I'm not sure Honda could go to another team like after McLaren because I don't think there is one who would want an engine, remember Red Bull was very unhappy with Renault for years, I don't see such a situation at the moment. Unless Honda buys an entire team which also seems unlikely. So Honda really needs to do well, for their own sake in F1. I certainly want them to recover and achieve success with Aston, but what I want does not matter of course.

Contrary to what some posters may think, Aston Martin fans want Honda to succeed and make a comeback next year.

Agreed.

Absolutely.