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However It would be nice if the title is changed to "Jacques lets Vettel Have it...Big time" as like a few others including myself, Strad,etc have a special place in our hearts for Gilles Villeneuve and seeing his surname used to make headlines...just doesn't feel right to me.
Mods edit please?
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.
Hail22 wrote:I have to agree with 90% of Jacques comments,
However It would be nice if the title is changed to "Jacques lets Vettel Have it...Big time" as like a few others including myself, Strad,etc have a special place in our hearts for Gilles Villeneuve and seeing his surname used to make headlines...just doesn't feel right to me.
Mods edit please?
"There is a credit card with the Ferrari logo, issued by Santander, which gives the scuderia a % of purchases made with the card...
I would guess that such a serious amount of money would allow them to ignore the constant complains of a car that was nowhere near as bad as their #1 driver tried to sell throughout the season.
Heck, a car on which Massa finishes in the podium or has to lift so that his teammate finishes ahead (As we saw often in the final races of the year) is, by no means, a "bad" car."
mnmracer wrote:The funny/sad thing is, despite Villeneuve being the prime example of a driver who only showed something in a fast car and couldn't do --- in a slow car, Vettel gets more slack than Villeneuve ever has...
As for letting Vettel have it. If you name Alonso as an example of calm and cool, to show how Vettel throws a fit, you don't know what you're talking about.
Yea, what does Villenuve know.........he's only a world champion, he aint got a clue what its like to be behind the Wheel.
Driving a car doesn't give you history-changing abilities. Hell, Senna's ghost could come back to claim the same, and it would still not erase historical happenings such as Trulli-Renault, "do you want me to lose the WDC?", the whole of 2007 or Abu Dhabi 2010, to name just a few.
Hail22 wrote:I have to agree with 90% of Jacques comments,
However It would be nice if the title is changed to "Jacques lets Vettel Have it...Big time" as like a few others including myself, Strad,etc have a special place in our hearts for Gilles Villeneuve and seeing his surname used to make headlines...just doesn't feel right to me.
Cylinder wrote:Jacques Villeneuve confirms what a few of us were already thinking.....
"For me, it has confirmed what I think about Vettel," Villeneuve told Autosprint of the race in Abu Dhabi. "These are facts: while recovering from the back, he first got in contact with Senna who was ahead of him and damaged his front wing.
"Then he lost control of his car and crashed under the safety car. A very serious error that had light consequences. As for the rest, he has shown to be super quick, but he was lucky and I'm not changing my mind: Alonso deserves the 2012 title more."
"I have no doubts: Fernando Alonso is the best, that's why I root for him," said the 1997 title winner.
"Seb is super quick, but there is a difference with Fernando that emerges in case of an unfavourable situation.
"Alonso remains calm, cool, and rational, while Vettel most of times gets upset, angry, screams and flicks the middle finger. He reacts like a child.
Such a hypocrite. How easy it must be in his tower looking down on everyone.
In 2007, Villeneuve released a music album called 'Private Paradise'. At the launch he stated to reporters "I hope the album makes a great success. I would never do something hoping to get criticised." You don't see Vettel bagging him out for only selling about 300 copies in Canada.
Its a cheap shot to criticise someone, when you don't like being criticised yourself. What's that about people in glass houses....
âThere is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.â
â Socrates Ignorance is a state of being uninformed. Ignorant describes a person in the state of being unaware
who deliberately ignores or disregards important information or facts. Š all rights reserved.
Cam wrote:Such a hypocrite. How easy it must be in his tower looking down on everyone.
In 2007, Villeneuve released a music album called 'Private Paradise'. At the launch he stated to reporters "I hope the album makes a great success. I would never do something hoping to get criticised." You don't see Vettel bagging him out for only selling about 300 copies in Canada.
Its a cheap shot to criticise someone, when you don't like being criticised yourself. What's that about people in glass houses....
Enjoy the show:
]
Please no more! I can't stand his singing! *locks self in engine bench testing room*
If someone said to me that you can have three wishes, my first would have been to get into racing, my second to be in Formula 1, my third to drive for Ferrari.
Blue fellow wrote:I would have never thought that a race where a driver starts in pitlane and finishes on the podium would be used against him. Regardless of the amount of luck involved. Or the mistakes that were made. The fact that a driver started from pitlane and finished on podium, I always thought that was respectable. I could never imagine people would use it against the driver.
You ha've to understand about humans nature
We are always jealous of people who have success
Jealousy may indirectly make us do things and make us successful
Maybe that's why we are one of the dominating species on earth
I agree with Villeneuve to a point. Though Alonso i a great driver and seems pretty calm now. When he was at McLaren he was the most childish driver i have seen in a long time.
Blue fellow wrote:I would have never thought that a race where a driver starts in pitlane and finishes on the podium would be used against him. Regardless of the amount of luck involved. Or the mistakes that were made. The fact that a driver started from pitlane and finished on podium, I always thought that was respectable. I could never imagine people would use it against the driver.
I honestly have no idea why you'd think it wouldn't be. It was probably the worst race he's ever driven. Not being able to separate luck from it and see that is the same thing basically as not being able to separate the RB6 and RB7 from his world championships.
Blue fellow wrote:I would have never thought that a race where a driver starts in pitlane and finishes on the podium would be used against him. Regardless of the amount of luck involved. Or the mistakes that were made. The fact that a driver started from pitlane and finished on podium, I always thought that was respectable. I could never imagine people would use it against the driver.
I honestly have no idea why you'd think it wouldn't be. It was probably the worst race he's ever driven. Not being able to separate luck from it and see that is the same thing basically as not being able to separate the RB6 and RB7 from his world championships.
If you honestly have no idea, you should look at yourself rather than Vettel.
Making up luck and twisting reality is easy; appreciating what has happened and what was done, is a satisfying skill.
Going by the most wrongly mentioned 'lucks', let's break it down:
Vettel was lucky to start from the pitlane and set his car up for the race
Well, first of all, if starting from the pitlane with a race set-up is beneficial, then why don't they just qualify with a race set-up. Even qualifying 24th with race set-up (if it would be so slow in qualifying) is better than starting from the pitlane.
The fastest way around the circuit (for the Red Bull) is with a high-downforce set-up. That is why they always choose the high-downforce set-up. Agree?
Having a high downforce set-up, means that youâre slower than other cars on the straight, and faster than other cars in the corners. Agree?
Having a car 12kph slower on the straight means that itâs significantly more difficult to overtake other cars. Agree?
Having a high-downforce set-up means that youâre faster than other cars in corners. Agree?
Since you canât overtake in corners, it means you have to adjust your speed to the car in front of you, since you canât drive through him. Agree?
So having the fastest set-up means that at best youâre only as fast as the car in front in the corners, and slower on the straight. Agree?
So the only way to have any chance of not losing massive amounts of time behind a car your car is incapable of overtaking, is by going for a low-downforce set-up. Agree?
But as weâve already established, the fastest way around the track in a Red Bull is with a high-downforce set-up. Remember?
So you either
- have a car that slows you down because youâre stuck behind a car that is faster at the only place you can overtake
or
- you have a car that allows you to pass the car slowing you down, but is slower overall because of the set-up.
For most other cars, the compromise between being able to race with others, and being fast over a lap, is minimal. Their fastest lap set-up still allows for a straight-line speed that makes overtaking possible. Red Bull in the meantime has a top-speed that is bettered by the HRT and Marussiaâs. Thatâs why Hamilton did not need to change his set-up in Spain: with his fastest lap set-up, he was 5th in the speed trap. With Vettelâs fastest lap set-up, he is 24th in the speed trap.
Vettel was lucky with the first safety car, as it closed the gap
Without the first safety car, he would not have been behind a swerving Ricciardo, and he would not have sustained the front wing damage that forced him in (in the Senna event, he lost no speed).
By the time he was back in p13 where he was before the safety car, the gap to the leaders was the same as before, so he gained no net time.
Vettel was lucky with the first safety car, as it put him on fresher tires
First of all, if a two-stopper was beneficial, they would have gone with that.
Vettel was matching Kimi's speed, while he was on hard tires, so there was no need for him to get fresh or soft tires if not for the wing damage made possible by the safety car.
Vettel was lucky to have people crash into eachother
The only people 'crashing into eachother' were Rosberg and HĂźlkenberg at the start, and Massa spinning with Webber.
Considering he made short work of the other Mercedes' and Force India, there is little doubt he would have had trouble with them. Maybe Massa would have given him some trouble, but considering Webber's relative pace, it's unlikely.
Vettel was lucky he only needed to overtake backmarkers
First of all, Vettel did 20 on-track overtakes. There are not that many backmarkers.
Among those he overtook were: Senna, Grosjean, di Resta, Schumacher and Button.
Sum up
Vettel's misfortune:
- missing FP3
- faulty fuel system
- having to switch to a set-up that lead to slower lap times
- incident with Ricciardo (pit stop and ruined strategy)
Vettel's luck:
- Getting closer to Button with the second safety car
CONCLUDING
Ignoring time lost in FP3, if Vettel had started on p3, he would have been in p2 after the first corner. Considering his race pace was matching Kimi on a set-up that was not beneficial to fastest time around the track, it's safe to assume he would have comfortably stayed ahead of Kimi. Compare that to running a non-beneficial set-up, having to plow through the field twice, and having your strategy set back, the only way you can claim Vettel was lucky is if you ignore what actually happened.
Fairly sure this was covered in great detail in the race thread, where it belongs. Here we're discussing a Canadian and his big mouth. Was the maple leaf right to have his two cents or should he stick to plucking strings?
âThere is only one good, knowledge, and one evil, ignorance.â
â Socrates Ignorance is a state of being uninformed. Ignorant describes a person in the state of being unaware
who deliberately ignores or disregards important information or facts. Š all rights reserved.
