Vodafone McLaren Mercedes 2013

[Absolutelee]

With a history like McLaren's I can't imagine that one bad season will really affect their ability to draw sponsors.

[Racer X]

With a history like McLaren's I can't imagine that one bad season will really affect their ability to draw sponsors.

Specially with all the Big Money Mexican Sponsors hopping to join McLaren I can see Telmex already with a spoken deal just waiting to be able to sign it.


Im more interested in the Livery for next year what the car going to look like with out Vodaphone and a new tittle sponsor. Would they request their own colors on the car....... could the chrome disapear or will that carry over Into McLarens future? As a big part now of its heritage.... or is it too much tied to the silver arrows'?

[SilverArrow10]

With a history like McLaren's I can't imagine that one bad season will really affect their ability to draw sponsors.

Specially with all the Big Money Mexican Sponsors hopping to join McLaren I can see Telmex already with a spoken deal just waiting to be able to sign it.


Im more interested in the Livery for next year what the car going to look like with out Vodaphone and a new tittle sponsor. Would they request their own colors on the car....... could the chrome disapear or will that carry over Into McLarens future? As a big part now of its heritage.... or is it too much tied to the silver arrows'?

I don't know about next year but I like to think in 2015 they will get rid of the silver Mercedes and have white Honda like McLaren of old, I know it was a Marlboro colour back in the day it fits Honda too. All they need is another red title sponsor Shame Telmex is blue.

[adrianjordan]

I would just die and go to heaven if than ran a special 1 year livery of McLaren Orange prior to unveiling a new livery that ties in with the Honda deal....

Edited to add: Telmex may use blue colours...but Claro has a red logo....

[Racer X]

I would just die and go to heaven if than ran a special 1 year livery of McLaren Orange prior to unveiling a new livery that ties in with the Honda deal....




Edited to add: Telmex may use blue colours...but Claro has a red logo....

Claro is Slims biggest company and its International where as Telmex is National. So maybe slim would favor Red/Orange over blue?

But who know...

How ever next year I too have been dreaming of them doing the old Orange Color.... that would be an Amazing 1 year thing they could do to wait for Honda and no longer being a works team with Mercedez they shouldn't give them free publicity by keeping to silver. Next year livery is going to be interesting. If they are smart they will keep the livery under wraps until the unveiling to build suspense for its new sponsors. Its going to be a long winter for us hoping for the old Orange livery.

[Holm86]

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2987 ... n-s-reach/

Button all of the sudden predicts podiums in the second half of the season. He is quite confident that more improvements will take the team a step forward. So I guess the MP4-28 isn't all given up upon. It could be nice to see McLaren finish this year strongly.

[Racer X]

Could it be they finally hit the nail on its head and figured out a few key things they messed up on'? Or better yet. Fixed the problems more then just understand them maybe they have fixed them. I would like to see if this is significant enough for the guys to fight for podiums.

[dren]

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/2987 ... n-s-reach/

Button all of the sudden predicts podiums in the second half of the season. He is quite confident that more improvements will take the team a step forward. So I guess the MP4-28 isn't all given up upon. It could be nice to see McLaren finish this year strongly.

He will go well at Spa. I love that race, can't wait!

[SectorOne]

It´s funny that even though they said the 27 performed way better then the wind tunnel suggested, they decided to scrap the fastest car from last year and build something entirely new.
Button could have been champ this year i think with a MP4-27.5

[beelsebob]

It´s funny that even though they said the 27 performed way better then the wind tunnel suggested, they decided to scrap the fastest car from last year and build something entirely new.
Button could have been champ this year i think with a MP4-27.5

I dunno, Button wasn't really anywhere close in the MP4-27 to Vettel in the RB8, only Hamilton could match or beat him. So it would take a pretty big upgrade relative to the RB9 to get button up there in an MP4-27.5.

[SectorOne]

Yea he got lost mid-season a bit but i think that was partly upgrade pack and just getting lost in the setup.
Should not happen again with a car that is much closer to it´s limit of development then before.

[Pup]

It´s funny that even though they said the 27 performed way better then the wind tunnel suggested, they decided to scrap the fastest car from last year and build something entirely new.
Button could have been champ this year i think with a MP4-27.5

On the other hand, I guess if they didn't know why the car performed well, then they had no clear path to improve it. They'd just have been stabbing in the dark to a certain extent. In that light, it actually makes their decision more understandable. That is, they'd be trading a design they didn't really understand for one that they thought they did, and which of course looked better on paper anyway. Of course, they ended up with a design they understood even less, but there was no way of predicting that.

We forget that last year's car was the quickest by far out of the box. Then they spent the better part of the season fiddling around with it with very little to show for their efforts, and by the time Europe came around they were behind. Then at the end of the season the car suddenly got fast again. So if they didn't understand why it got fast, then I can see them wanting to dump it.

Elsewhere I've seen Whitmarsh quoted from the same interview, saying that a major part of their problem is too much compartmentalization within McLaren. Individual groups working on wings, sidepods, suspension, etc., and not enough communication between them. I would argue that he should say 'not a clear vision guiding them' - a small but important distinction, imo.

I used to scoff at people who said that McLaren needs a Newey of their own, but the past few years have made me reconsider that to a large part.

[hollus]

On the other hand, I guess if they didn't know why the car performed well, then they had no clear path to improve it. They'd just have been stabbing in the dark to a certain extent. In that light, it actually makes their decision more understandable. That is, they'd be trading a design they didn't really understand for one that they thought they did, and which of course looked better on paper anyway. Of course, they ended up with a design they understood even less, but there was no way of predicting that.

A word comes to mind: arrogance (the underscoring is mine).

I find it very interesting that BAR Honda had exactly the same problem in 2004, when the car performed better than the wind tunnel data said it should, and they never understood why. They also went on to produce a melon for 2005.
Of course in both cases there was one Jenson Button in the driver roster. Coincidence?

[Holm86]

On the other hand, I guess if they didn't know why the car performed well, then they had no clear path to improve it. They'd just have been stabbing in the dark to a certain extent. In that light, it actually makes their decision more understandable. That is, they'd be trading a design they didn't really understand for one that they thought they did, and which of course looked better on paper anyway. Of course, they ended up with a design they understood even less, but there was no way of predicting that.

A word comes to mind: arrogance (the underscoring is mine).

I find it very interesting that BAR Honda had exactly the same problem in 2004, when the car performed better than the wind tunnel data said it should, and they never understood why. They also went on to produce a melon for 2005.
Of course in both cases there was one Jenson Button in the driver roster. Coincidence?

I don't think its quite a coincidence. I've talked about that before. I really don't think that Button is very good at developing a car. And I do think that Hamilton has been underestimated as a development driver.

I think the loss of Hamilton is a key point in them not being able to develop this years car. And of course the loss of the man who designed it (Lowe).

Back with the MP4-24 I'm sure Hamiltons inputs helped a lot in turning it into a race winner. Button just often seems confused and not able to find a suitable set up for himself.

But the reason I think they are believing in a strong race at Spa could be the new tires. I do think the deformation of the first 2013 tires caused a lot of their problems in the windtunnel. Perhaps the switch to the old 2012 construction of the tires means they have a better correlation between their simulation data an on-track data.

[Pup]

I agree about Button, but the problem with car setup is that if you don't have a teammate who's trouncing you, you can easily have no clue that you've gone down the wrong path.

So who knows if the car could be faster than it is, or if development has been hurt because of it? It's all speculation unless Sergio starts besting Button by a second or two per lap.