2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[etusch]

Yes but he is not first time in Williams. And a question marq why Pat Symonds leave the team

[Thunder]

"Mclaren Mercedes"
And if the FIA ​​says "No"? The time to announce new engine supplier, has ended.

Why would the FIA say no? If McLaren sign a PU Supply Contract with Merc there is nothing the FIA can do.....

I know what Deadline you mean but it has been posted several times on the last few Pages what that Deadline actually means and why it doesn't apply here, i'm not gonna write it again.

[Manoah2u]

I just recalled something i posted last year, really little has changed - though i must say, my 'respect' for Zak Brown has grown a bit, though i'm still seeing zero results.

[Jolle]

Yes but he is not first time in Williams. And a question marq why Pat Symonds leave the team

The last time he was at Williams he was responsible for the highly experimental and advanced systems that made Mansell’s car unbeatable.

[Joseki]

I just recalled something i posted last year, really little has changed - though i must say, my 'respect' for Zak Brown has grown a bit, though i'm still seeing zero results.

You should ask Hasegawa for results.

[makecry]

I just recalled something i posted last year, really little has changed - though i must say, my 'respect' for Zak Brown has grown a bit, though i'm still seeing zero results.

You should ask Hasegawa for results.

Well Hasegawa said last year they can match Ferrari without token system. =D>

[ZakB]

No McLaren engineer will ever get to see Mercedes code. Also they can send different codes. Heck nowadays they can even have the upgrade version of an engine ready just a few GP's later.

I really don't think Findia and williams can extract the same of merc PU as Merc can. The two main reasons for that are probably the agressive code maps and the integration with the rest of the car.
I bet they can't even go with a low cooling setup as aggressive as mercedes cause mercedes wouldn't want to risk the publicity of their PU's blowing.

If you think about it there are always more problems with factory Merc PU than with the clients. I would say it's because they ran more aggressive modes and cooling

Sorry, but Williams and Force India are both small teams compared to McLaren. They don't have the same resources and with the same engine McLaren should be miles ahead of them. I'm not saying they will beat Mercedes, but they will certainly be closer than those two.

Last time we've seen Williams and McLaren fighting against each other with the same Mercedes engine McLaren was far behind.

They completely reorganised the aero department and it seems like they are on the right track. It's easy to pick a bad season, but I could do the same for Williams in all of the previous years.

[FrukostScones]

Williams won a race in 2012 with Maldonado and probably could have won in 2014 (Massa/Canada), and that's a customer team running around with sub-200M budget.

Even if moving to Mercedes power means a budget drop below 300M McLaren could at least return to winning races, and from there attract a big title sponsor.

Oh yes, I forgot about Maldonado.

A big sponsor isn't enough these days. Williams have a big old fashioned sponsor and they only manage, with all their experience and a good partnership with Mercedes, a podium here and there.

A big sponsor like Vodafone or Martini bring in around 50-60 mln dollar a year, a investor or partner (like PM, Daimler) around 200-250 mln a year.

Maldo would have won in 2014 again if he didnt leave because all the crazy acusations. Everyone
Who follewed the rumors knew Merc PU would be the winner. Surely McZakMcLaren Mercrdes could win races with ALO today.

[ZakB]

There is going to be a budget cap anyway after 2020, so who cares if they lose these Honda dollars (which aren't worth much anyway considering the price money and sponsors that are running away). I'm pretty sure their shareholders will fix that hole in the coming seasons, so they can perform and Brown can do his marketing magic. I wouldn't put my sticker on this McLaren-Honda currently, only negative exposure.

[Squid]

There is going to be a budget cap anyway after 2020, so who cares if they lose these Honda dollars (which aren't worth much anyway considering the price money and sponsors that are running away). I'm pretty sure their shareholders will fix that hole in the coming seasons, so they can perform and Brown can do his marketing magic. I wouldn't put my sticker on this McLaren-Honda currently, only negative exposure.

Yeah, good luck enforcing a budget cap.

[etusch]

Oh my God still there is same sponsor myth

[Chuckjr]

Mike Gascoyne now joining the groups claiming Macca has not only decided to leave Honda, but has already moved to secure Merc engines.

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/ ... onda_made/

[Raleigh]

Only option now.

Honda have cost McLaren and Fernando 3 years now and there is no sign of a turnaround.

And no, McLaren having a good chassis over those three years is not down to Honda money, the change was drawing Prodromou from Red Bull to head up aero direction.

[Joseki]

Mike Gascoyne now joining the groups claiming Macca has not only decided to leave Honda, but has already moved to secure Merc engines.

http://www.gptoday.com/full_story/view/ ... onda_made/

I'm pretty sure that McLaren is moving towards Mercedes regardless of what the current situation with Honda is. They know well what happened to Red Bull after they ditched Renault for Mercedes. It's surely better to scrap a contract with Mercedes than arriving in November with no engine for next year.

[GhostF1]

All that I have read here for the last month or two has been people flaming the others for supporting the move to stay with Honda, calling them fanboys, dreamers etc. However all the "pro-Mercedes" blokes don't have a shred of evidence to suggest they'll be successful going that route either. Dreamers in their own right also.

We have no idea how easy the integration of the Merc PU will be to the MCL chassis, whether or not that will require a complete rework of its structure, we have no idea, we have no idea how similar any of the controls work in comparison, no idea about how the chassis will react to it's delivery, the drivers will have to completely relearn how to drive the thing. I'm all for moving up the damn field sooner rather than later, but it's an extremely short sighted view to assume the fastest engine in this chassis will create a winning team in the next year. Alonso has stated "I'm not interested in P7, P5 or even P4... that's not why I'm here". So why would the promise of maybe heading the midfield next year (and that's only if McLaren absolutely bloody ace the integration first go) entice him enough to stay if they still pray for race accidents for podiums...

We are also forgetting how the team work internally, that would all completely change as well.. No matter which you cut it, McLaren took a gamble and it has failed to pay off right now, it looked to be coming good in the second half of last season, with the Honda PU actually being quite competitive but the MP4-31 had the inherent rear end fault confirmed at Suzuka and that was the limiter. Even this year, Matt Morris said they had a fundamental flaw and they spent way more time developing last years car (compared to everyone else) so they could properly understand its problems, that why this years car debuted in a relatively basic form and has progressed in-season. Honda took a further gamble to jump the competition with a new architecture and they are running into MGU-H issues (sound familiar? This was Merc which burnt them out incessantly last year). For those who have bothered to keep tabs on Hasegawa's reports, they have the MGU-H solution ready (but it would require them to take a penalty to implement), they have said the entire top end is being redesigned and it's implementation date is coming up, they also have other improvements at the ready, it's just a game of when (yet people somehow continue to say not good enough from their end, yet their development rate is clearly off the charts).

I think either way they go it's a gamble for next year, but with the knowledge they will have Sauber next year as a customer team also to help with data is another positive (they obviously showed Monisha something to impress her enough to score the contract), I personally think the wiser choice is to stick with them, through the heartache. Media hilarity and slagging goes nowhere, even if you are in the right.. it just gives the reporters ammunition down the line.