2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[j.yank]

http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opini ... gine-chase

McLaren’s is very much to split with Honda after three disastrous seasons. It has simply lost the faith.

If someone in F1 is guided by faith, he is doomed. Can these guys think rational?

[ZakB]

http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opini ... gine-chase

McLaren’s is very much to split with Honda after three disastrous seasons. It has simply lost the faith.

If someone in F1 is guided by faith, he is doomed. Can these guys think rational?

Can you think rational? Lacking 85BHP on custom Mercedes after three years and expecting them to close that gap in three years, while they haven't produced anything decent this year.

[f1316]

Interesting article:

Inside Line: Why is McLaren so keen on problematic Renault?

https://www.grandprix247.com/2017/09/05 ... r-renault/

Don't believe for a second the Renault engine is even close to 1.5s slower than a Mercedes on a 90 sec lap - 0.5 seems closer to the mark in the race; depends on the track as well, of course.

The FIA would have you believe that, according to the data supplied by the manufacturers themselves, it's within 0.3, although I highly doubt it.

He also mentions that it's not a proven race winner - point of fact is that it is and has won in 3 of the 4 hybrid seasons. Whether or not it's dependent on luck, the reality is that there's reason no one other than Mercedes , Ferrari or Red Bull have won in this era (and RB have still won more races than Ferrari) which is that you have to be within striking distance. None of the Mercedes customers have managed that.

[Sasha]

McLaren/Porsche in 2021.

So McLaren thinks it is better to use a customer PU for 18,19 and 20 to keep them mid-field with some podiums(RB like).
To get sponsors back.

But RB is putting a wrench to the plan by asking for works like money from Honda or McLaren for STR.
(Honda or McLaren will not do it)

So what is going on right on is a big game of chicken(poker).
McLaren is doing everything to get rid of Honda.
RB is doing everything to get the money.
Liberty is doing everything to keep Honda.
Honda is doing everything to stay with McLaren.

[Pany]

If there was possibility to stay with renault 1 year only and then back to a more reliable and competitive honda...... Could be a good deal for both

[Chene_Mostert]

If there was possibility to stay with renault 1 year only and then back to a more reliable and competitive honda...... Could be a good deal for both

why would Honda be better one year later?

[erlik]

McLaren/Porsche in 2021.

Wouldn't be there conflict from automotive point of view?

[RS200E]

McLaren/Porsche in 2021.

So McLaren thinks it is better to use a customer PU for 18,19 and 20 to keep them mid-field with some podiums(RB like).
To get sponsors back.

But RB is putting a wrench to the plan by asking for works like money from Honda or McLaren for STR.
(Honda or McLaren will not do it)

So what is going on right on is a big game of chicken(poker).
McLaren is doing everything to get rid of Honda.
RB is doing everything to get the money.
Liberty is doing everything to keep Honda.
Honda is doing everything to stay with McLaren.

Why say McLaren Porche 2021 when even the autosport article says it might even be with Williams or Red Bull.

Your post is sensationally nonsense.

That's like me going into the Williams thread and saying Williams Porche 2021.

Sounds stupid doesn't it.

[fellowhoodlums]

Tuesday....7.20pm....no announcement yet.......sounds like RBR in the guise of Torro Rosso are playing hardball.....

When is Red Bull's Renault agreement until? Makes you wonder if they'll make the jump in 2019

[alexa]

Looks like they will announce on Thursday

https://tr.motorsport.com/f1/news/minar ... di-949537/

[NL_Fer]

Lose a more competitive PU
Lose a racing seat
Cost to design a new lowerback of the car

What would you think that would cost.

[Andres125sx]

At least take 30sec. on Google to check your Facts next time....
https://www.motorsport-magazin.com/form ... ente-2017/

Maybe that´s good reliability for you, not for me. Don´t get fooled with Honda comparison, Renault is building PUs for the same time Mercedes and Ferrari. Compare with those and you´ll realize Renault reliability is far from decent. Better to Honda, ok, but with more experience.

I don´t think McLaren is willing to break a good contract with Honda only to use a different PU wich also receive several penalties due to lack of reliability, and that without good perfomance. At least now they get paid by Honda

Who said anything about good reliability? You were takling about similar reliability.

Red Bull used 46 Parts, Toro Rosso and Renault 42 each. McLaren used 89. Yeah, almost the same....

Fair enough, I was thinking about some sort of ratio like failures*experience

[Andres125sx]

Seriously people, is it so hard to understand the concept of damage mitigation ?!

- Yes we all wished at some point that Honda finally had a breaktrough with their PU.
- Yes it´s better to have a works deal anytime before a customer deal.
- Yes Mclaren wants championships and not just random wins/podiums

...And the list can go on and on. But you know what guys, that ship has sailed!

That´s what your crystal ball said?

Or you´ve some insights from Honda, have seen the PU, the engineers, etc. and know their work is useless and they will never solve their problems, not in this, next or 2019 seasons?
...

I dont have a crystal ball, but Mclaren has more insight about the whole affair plus a guy named Illien, as I mentioned in my post. So, do you think they´ll make this decision to split "just because?" Or do you actually believe that Mclaren is willing to wait for the 4, 5 years it usually takes to become winners? If that was the case that would be an easy PR talk to feed for all the media, fans and staff enduring the situation; dont you think?

If you´ve payed attention to Zaks interviews, Alonso (Last night at "El Hormiguero" http://soymotor.com/noticias/alonso-en- ... ana-939059) , and EBs latest (below); you´d know that Mclaren and company are at their limit and cannot afford to wait any longer for Honda to come good. The plan was 3 years, not 4, not 5. So yeah, both are to blame for "Believing" they could outdo F1 history

Eric Boullier: Honda failed. It's time to make a decision

Source: https://www.f1news.ru/interview/boullier/123499.shtml

Racing director McLaren Eric Boullier in an exclusive interview with F1News.ru unequivocally stated that Honda did not cope with the tasks that faced the Japanese minder - probably these words can be considered a kind of sentence.

In the text of the interview there are a few more points that indirectly confirm: in McLaren are preparing to change the supplier of engines, and Fernando Alonso may well remain in the team for at least a year ...

[snip]

Thanks for the deailed reply. But I still can´t see anything stating they will not be able to win with Honda as you stated, only concerns about the viability of the project, wich is logical at this point, but it´s only the media who is taking McLaren contacts to evaluate their options as a certainity about McLaren and Honda split.

I´m not saying they will keep Honda, nor they´ll surely suceed with Honda, but you can´t either say the ship has sailed as a certainty of the project failure. Not yet.

[Andres125sx]

Seriously people, is it so hard to understand the concept of damage mitigation ?!

- Yes we all wished at some point that Honda finally had a breaktrough with their PU.
- Yes it´s better to have a works deal anytime before a customer deal.
- Yes Mclaren wants championships and not just random wins/podiums

...And the list can go on and on. But you know what guys, that ship has sailed!

That´s what your crystal ball said?

Or you´ve some insights from Honda, have seen the PU, the engineers, etc. and know their work is useless and they will never solve their problems, not in this, next or 2019 seasons?


Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes, all the dominant teams in past decade/s, actually needed 3-4 seasons before succeding. Assuming they won´t succed because they didn´t in 3th season, when they were severly restricted by token in two thirds of that period is so absurd... it´s pure fanboyism... "I don´t like them, I´m bored, get rid of them"

If Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes needed 3-4 seasons to succed without restrictions, I think 4-5 seasons is the least we should concede to McHonda.

But you need some perspective to be that patient

We haven't seen anyone getting on the level of Mercedes, but you expect that Honda will create something that is better than them in three years time? You're calling others a fanboy, but I would call you delusional.

Nope, I´m not expecting that, far from that, I never said that. But they don´t need to be better or match Mercedes to be a better option than a Renault PU as a customer team. I´d prefer a Honda PU with works team status at similar level of perfomance to Renault, than a Renault PU as another customer at the same time to RBR

Do you think matching Renault perfomance and reliability is delusional?

[diffuser]

Looks like they will announce on Thursday

https://tr.motorsport.com/f1/news/minar ... di-949537/

That artical doesn't say anything new ...it basically says

McLaren will sign a deal with Renault if Toro Rosso agrees to pass the Honda engine. Otherwise it will continue unintentionally with the Honda engine.