2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[kasio]

Problem solving usually requires adressing the big problems first, then the smaller ones later.

this is what you are suugesting?
that is not the way to work in a company or group. you split tasks, problems an you solve them separately. especially when we know that most of problems are non blocking.

[Wazari]

But honestly Wazari, do you still believe in this spec4 ? Because why would this spec4 suddenly be so much better after all we have seen so far....

I do. Because I know the differences between current spec and spec 4.

[alexa]

When are we going to see spec 4?

[ZakB]

When are we going to see spec 4?

After the Japanese GP, either Mexico or US. At that point it's going to be too little, too late. Maybe they are going to switch to Renault temporary, but I highly doubt that will happen. McLaren really needs to thank god that Alain Prost is working at Renault, he really showed some sympathy for McLaren in his last interview. Great guy.

[NL_Fer]

Seriously people, is it so hard to understand the concept of damage mitigation ?!

- Yes we all wished at some point that Honda finally had a breaktrough with their PU.
- Yes it´s better to have a works deal anytime before a customer deal.
- Yes Mclaren wants championships and not just random wins/podiums

...And the list can go on and on. But you know what guys, that ship has sailed!

What Mclaren is trying to pull of right now is a way to survive until the next engine rules come 2020. By then, hopefully, they would have rebuilt the brand and racing team image/credibility in the face of fans, sponsors and the likes. Its not personal folks, its business!

As already stated by Zak Brown; Mclaren shareholders are going to "tank" these following years in order for the team to recover from all this mess and retain key personnel. We´re talking designers, mechanics (Lord have mercy on those poor souls!) , star drivers or even interested prospects. I mean, has anyone given serious thought about the morale of the staff or how would any other upcoming F1 talent would want to join the team if a situation like this drags on?

We´re talking about a very high level crisis scenario here. I really wouldnt want to be in the shoes of Zak Brown or even Hasegawa or Yamamoto San. Mclaren is trying to save their brand and racing team from a repeat of this year; and if that means settling in the short term as customers of a "less than ideal" engine partner, than so be it. Honda in the other hand, must also be in a lot of pressure to demonstrate how good their upgrades can/will eventually become, but alas, Mclaren simply cannot gamble another year with them, or else...

Lets not forget that Illmor was working with Renault for the past years, and is now supposed to have been working along Honda (As per Mclaren request) since early this year. All this in order to validate or assess the developements or improvements that Honda has on the pipeline. So, rest assure that when Zak Brown says "We´re going to be talking with people that know quite a lot more than us about these engines..." ; its because by now Illmor would have had a clear conclusion on the prospects of Hondas gains with this PU design.

So please consider guys that this decision process wont be something taken lightly and in detriment of the teams future. Thats what we, as Mclaren fans, must trust for now. There will be a day when we´re back at the very top, but its almost certain that day would have to wait until the next rule set and when/if new engine suppliers come into play. That´ll be our next gamble and lets all hope it finally works out for us. Until then...#BelieveninMclaren

Very good insight. McLaren has already postponed any championships to 2021. On the short run, 2018 2019 Renault is much closer to the top. Then Honda can get their act together.

Remember in 2021 the engine should be a smaller factor in overal performance and also easier to develop because of the mgu-h being binned. Also new manufacturers are coming in.

[Joseki]

From my Twitter feed:



"liked by Zak Brown"

[GoranF1]

I dont think Renault loves RB too much whit their history, i think until Renault Sport is ready for title they will give Mclaren their best PU and maybe there is a promise from Alonso to join them in the future if they provide a fair PU to. Mclaren.
Peter Prodrumou and Matt Morris can match Adrian.

Until Renault Sport is ready for title... good clarification Goran. So they will receive best PU they can get from third PU manufacturer, until Renault manage to match Ferrari and Mercedes PUs, then McLaren will stop receiving best PU Renault can provide because it will be Renault who will fight for titles instead of McLaren

In my eyes that´s best way to guarantee McLaren will never receive a PU to fight for titles

I didnt ment that at all, i ment until Renault is ready on all levels for title, PU, Chassis, drivers, development etc.
And that will take a while.

[Thunder]

2- Reliability: similar to Honda, ask Verstappen

At least take 30sec. on Google to check your Facts next time....
https://www.motorsport-magazin.com/form ... ente-2017/

[Vasconia]

2- Reliability: similar to Honda, ask Verstappen

At least take 30sec. on Google to check your Facts next time....
https://www.motorsport-magazin.com/form ... ente-2017/

Plus other Renault powered cars are having much better reliability.

[Vasconia]

And not even with RBR chassis and Newey genius they were able to fight for any title, not even remotedly

So if we assume McLaren only need to be a solid midfielder, then yes, the deal is great, but if we assume McLaren should be fighting for titles...

plus, who wants McLaren to win races and become WC? Renault doesn't, they probably, when their own team is competitive going to drop RedBull. Mercedes doesn't and certainly doesn't. At this moment the only one is Honda.

Renault is NOT a permanent solution, that's obvious. But for the next couple of years it's much, much better to be on a podium and have a few wins than NOTHING AT ALL.

Agree, but IMHO that route is short sighted if the real target is becoming world champions again at some point

McLaren will stay with Renault until Honda is ready or new manufacturers enter. Temporal solution to collect more points and some podiums. With better performances sponsors will return and McLaren´s situation will be better, easing the pressure for a new PU change.

Now the pressure is too much and nothing good will come from it. Honda and McLaren don´t work as a united team and this third season has showed that with his atmosphere inside the team results won´t come.

[Manoah2u]

From my Twitter feed:

http://i.imgur.com/7tGfVvE.png

"liked by Zak Brown"

that looks amazing

[etusch]

PU change was logical for McLaren at preseason test for season start or Europe. But after this stage it's completely wrong time.

[Phil]

McLaren will stay with Renault until Honda is ready or new manufacturers enter. Temporal solution to collect more points and some podiums. With better performances sponsors will return and McLaren´s situation will be better, easing the pressure for a new PU change.

Dont believe for a second that Honda will take McLaren back as a customer after such an ugly breakup. There is a lot at stake for Honda. If this break up goes through, with all the public humiliation, this partnership is gone for good. If Honda goes with RedBull/TorroRosso, they'll be riding that success story (if it comes to that), not McLaren.

[Andres125sx]

2- Reliability: similar to Honda, ask Verstappen

At least take 30sec. on Google to check your Facts next time....
https://www.motorsport-magazin.com/form ... ente-2017/

Maybe that´s good reliability for you, not for me. Don´t get fooled with Honda comparison, Renault is building PUs for the same time Mercedes and Ferrari. Compare with those and you´ll realize Renault reliability is far from decent. Better to Honda, ok, but with more experience.

I don´t think McLaren is willing to break a good contract with Honda only to use a different PU wich also receive several penalties due to lack of reliability, and that without good perfomance. At least now they get paid by Honda

[Andres125sx]

Seriously people, is it so hard to understand the concept of damage mitigation ?!

- Yes we all wished at some point that Honda finally had a breaktrough with their PU.
- Yes it´s better to have a works deal anytime before a customer deal.
- Yes Mclaren wants championships and not just random wins/podiums

...And the list can go on and on. But you know what guys, that ship has sailed!

That´s what your crystal ball said?

Or you´ve some insights from Honda, have seen the PU, the engineers, etc. and know their work is useless and they will never solve their problems, not in this, next or 2019 seasons?


Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes, all the dominant teams in past decade/s, actually needed 3-4 seasons before succeding. Assuming they won´t succed because they didn´t in 3th season, when they were severly restricted by token in two thirds of that period is so absurd... it´s pure fanboyism... "I don´t like them, I´m bored, get rid of them"

If Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes needed 3-4 seasons to succed without restrictions, I think 4-5 seasons is the least we should concede to McHonda.

But you need some perspective to be that patient