2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[ZakB]

And waste three more years? The McLaren Honda relationship is done, there is no base to continue. Honda isn't willing to accept help from outside, they could even buy technology from Mercedes, but declined.

I'm not sure if you're aware or not, but McLaren are in such a position that there isn't an engine available in those three years that can carry them to a title. Podiums ? Likely. A few race wins ? Probably. But definitely not the title. Honda or not, the soonest opportunity McLaren can get for a title challenge is 2021. No new manufacturer will be so out of their mind to come in before then; Mercedes is a no go (and so is Ferrari), Renault have their works team and Red Bull are second in line. McLaren are almost certain to get 2nd rate engines if they switch to Renault, and that will never be enough to win the title.

That's all McLaren wants the coming three years. McLaren doesn't expect any titles in the coming years. They just want to perform until 2021, where most of the parts probably get standardized, like the turbo and MGU-K, while the MGU-H will be removed. The whole point of those rules are to make sure that non works teams can also compete at the highest level. Renault is also required to provide McLaren with equal engines.

So this all begs the question as to why the current McLaren management are so desperate to switch to Renault. Is it all to then say "heeey look, we pulled the team from 10th on the grid up to fourth, ain't that great?" at the end of 2018. In Turkish we call it "dostlar alışverişte görsün". It roughly means let's be seen as doing something. And that 6 position of championship will not even make up for losing Honda's financial support and having to pay for Renault engines.

I call it good progress. Zak Brown already said it's not going to be a decision made on economics. McLaren has seen all the empty Honda promises and have a lot more information than you guys here. The only thing the people in here say: 'it will come good' and 'there is no difference between place 10 or 4'. I'm glad McLaren won't be running those --- stains next year and I hope all the Honda fanboys quickly move to the Toro Rosso topic.

[Shrieker]

I call it good progress.

Maybe for a team the caliber of Sauber, Haas or Toro Rosso. Not for a team that has the history and heritage of McLaren. Renault switch is a lot of financial burden without much to offer for a team like McLaren. Maaaybe 4th or 5th in the WCC can attract a few more sponsors compared to say 9th-10th, but that's about it. Which is not vital for them at all. They've had a lack of sponsors for many years now, and they've been doing just fine.

and I hope all the Honda fanboys quickly move to the Toro Rosso topic.

Well I'm not one I openly said McLaren should suck Honda's money and use it to kickstart their own engine programme. Honda should consider it asshole tax for offering a snail to McLaren for three years in a row.

[ZakB]

I call it good progress.

Maybe for a team the caliber of Sauber, Haas or Toro Rosso. Not for a team that has the history and heritage of McLaren. Renault switch is a lot of financial burden without much to offer for a team like McLaren. Maaaybe 4th or 5th in the WCC can attract a few more sponsors compared to say 9th-10th, but that's about it. Which is not vital for them at all. They've had a lack of sponsors for many years now, and they've been doing just fine.

Funny, you're naming teams that McLaren currently needs to fight. McLaren no longer wants that. They know exactly what Honda has promised and delivered. Like Boullier said, they haven't reached one single target. Some people in here seem to forget that McLaren has people working for them with actual feelings. The factory is running 24/7, how can you say something like 'it doesn't make a difference if you're 9th or 4th'. The last time Honda was successful was in the late 80's. Some people even feel sorry for Honda? But it seems everyone already forgot how they left Formula 1 because of the financial crisis.

[diffuser]

No matter how often you say "it's done" isn't gonna change the fact that it isn't done.

if it was done it would be announced and it isn't.

Regardless if Renault is better or worse, if McLaren wants to leave or not, if alonso drives for McLaren, Indy or Pumps gas at a local Gas station. It isn't in McLaren's control who they end up with.

Stop saying it's a done deal cause it isn't. I wouldn't give a move to Renault more than a 40% chance. The likely hood drops 1- 2% everyday.

[gdogg371]

50p says two McLaren/Hondas roll out of the pits for FP1 at Melbourne...

[RS200E]

50p says two McLaren/Hondas roll out of the pits for FP1 at Melbourne...

The proposed swap wasn't for this year was it? So my life savings says the same :p

[Squid]

And waste three more years? The McLaren Honda relationship is done, there is no base to continue. Honda isn't willing to accept help from outside, they could even buy technology from Mercedes, but declined.

Honda has been using plenty of outside help. With so much talk about Ilmor and Hasegawa's repeated statements, it's amazing that the "Honda doesn't accept outside help" argument is still being thrown around.

You know, every time you post I'm more convinced that you're just a troll. You always manage to conveniently ignore everything that doesn't validate your biases.

Edit: Turns out adding ZakB to your ignore list greatly improves the quality of any McLaren thread.

[Manoah2u]

So i've read Mclaren is concidering building their own engines for 2021.

Could the conversations with Renault actually be about hiring their expertise and help to build an engine? and sharing expertise from their side as some sort of exchange?

[DFX]

So i've read Mclaren is concidering building their own engines for 2021.

Could the conversations with Renault actually be about hiring their expertise and help to build an engine? and sharing expertise from their side as some sort of exchange?

I really don't think so. Zack Brown has stated the same about Le mans P1: They will consider if the costs are low enough.

Even if the costs are lowered by half, I don't think F1 will ever be affordable for a independent or small engine manufacture as Mclaren.

Although they might be gathering useful informations by talking with Renault (expected upgrades, power gain and so on).

[bigblue]

I'm glad McLaren won't be running those --- stains next year

Some people in here seem to forget that McLaren has people working for them with actual feelings.

Charming ...

[Andres125sx]

The same day that Alonso has removed all references to the Mclaren Honda. He published this:

https://twitter.com/alo_oficial/status/ ... 6820549632

Alonso moving to indy for a year would be the best for all parties involved. Let Honda work in peace for a year and then come back in 2019 for one final push to the title. Mclaren already has button on it's payroll.

So you think it´s only Alonso who put pressure on Honda?

Do you know McLaren wall crew has a button (different from Jenson ) to ban any radio com they want so FIA can´t broadcast it? Every single rant we´ve hear from Alonso was with McLaren blessing, wich means Mclaren actually use Alonso as a tool to put pressure on Honda

Removing Alonso won´t make things easier for Honda, only a performing PU will make things easier for Honda

[ZakB]

The same day that Alonso has removed all references to the Mclaren Honda. He published this:

https://twitter.com/alo_oficial/status/ ... 6820549632

Alonso moving to indy for a year would be the best for all parties involved. Let Honda work in peace for a year and then come back in 2019 for one final push to the title. Mclaren already has button on it's payroll.

So you think it´s only Alonso who put pressure on Honda?

Do you know McLaren wall crew has a button (different from Jenson ) to ban any radio com they want so FIA can´t broadcast it? Every single rant we´ve hear from Alonso was with McLaren blessing, wich means Mclaren actually use Alonso as a tool to put pressure on Honda

Removing Alonso won´t make things easier for Honda, only a performing PU will make things easier for Honda

They actually think that.

They also think that Honda will produce a better engine than Ferrari, Mercedes and Renault in the coming years, because of the big progress they have shown this year. People in here defend Honda with their lives, I even received PM's from people that showed me evidence that some in here have multiple accounts, to upvote their own messages.

[nzjrs]

Do you know McLaren wall crew has a button (different from Jenson ) to ban any radio com they want so FIA can´t broadcast it?

Are you sure this is still True? I know it used to be true, but sometime around the last radio 'driver coaching' controversy last year, they changed the rules such that teams had many fewer (a limited number) of private messages, or they removed that privacy aspect regulation altogether.

[ZakB]

Do you know McLaren wall crew has a button (different from Jenson ) to ban any radio com they want so FIA can´t broadcast it?

Are you sure this is still True? I know it used to be true, but sometime around the last radio 'driver coaching' controversy last year, they changed the rules such that teams had many fewer (a limited number) of private messages, or they removed that privacy aspect regulation altogether.

It's not the case, although they don't broadcast messages that can influence the race or affect the team.

[Sayeman]

The same day that Alonso has removed all references to the Mclaren Honda. He published this:

https://twitter.com/alo_oficial/status/ ... 6820549632

Alonso moving to indy for a year would be the best for all parties involved. Let Honda work in peace for a year and then come back in 2019 for one final push to the title. Mclaren already has button on it's payroll.

So you think it´s only Alonso who put pressure on Honda?

Do you know McLaren wall crew has a button (different from Jenson ) to ban any radio com they want so FIA can´t broadcast it? Every single rant we´ve hear from Alonso was with McLaren blessing, wich means Mclaren actually use Alonso as a tool to put pressure on Honda

Removing Alonso won´t make things easier for Honda, only a performing PU will make things easier for Honda

You do have to admit that some of the pressure is coming from the fact that Fernando is having to rot in the back and not having a car that complements his talent. There is also the added pressure from the spanish media...

Its the same as Valentino Rossi with Italian media.