https://tr.motorsport.com/f1/news/hamil ... i/6662374/Mercedes driver Lewis Hamilton said that Red Bull has accelerated with the latest update and they need to do something.
https://tr.motorsport.com/f1/news/hamil ... i/6662374/Mercedes driver Lewis Hamilton said that Red Bull has accelerated with the latest update and they need to do something.
I don't think it would take a lot of effort to find more things said by Christian Horner that are not true or atleast not the entire truth.RZS10 wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 00:27Edited since i found the time to add a source
In an interview with sky Horner quite literally said that the car was built around Max' driving style:
With regards to the drivers' involvement in development:Both in qualifying and in the race, the Mexican is clearly number two in the team. How does Horner explain that?
He refers to the special characteristics of the current RB16B and says that the car "certainly developed around Max' driving style", as the team boss puts it.He also said that Max likes a nervous car on corner entry.But by 2022, Perez will find it easier, says Horner. Formula 1 would then open a whole new chapter and technically start "from scratch". [...] In fact, Red Bull Perez has already been involved in "preparatory work" for 2022, says Horner. "That will of course intensify in the second half of the year. Checo will play a very active role there."..."This car is very nervous at the corner entry, as Max likes it," Red Bull team boss Horner said.
Those quotes are all from sky, that was after they confirmed Perez but before the Belgian GP when Horner explained why they kept him and why he was struggling.
So going by Horner's very own words it wouldn't really be a myth, both that a car will inevitably end up suiting a driver if he's with the team for long enough and that some drivers prefer a (obviously still balanced) but oversteery/nervous car on entry.
I won't be surprised if they do.etusch wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 15:24Hope fia will not ban bringing update to car
https://tr.motorsport.com/f1/news/hamil ... i/6662374/Mercedes driver Lewis Hamilton said that Red Bull has accelerated with the latest update and they need to do something.
Again: having a balanced car really comes down to driving style suited to the setup/car. Someone who trailbrakes more will have a harder time in a car which is more prone to oversteer for example. Where someone who trailbrakes less will find it perfectly balanced or maybe even understeering.Gillian wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 19:43I don't think it would take a lot of effort to find more things said by Christian Horner that are not true or atleast not the entire truth.RZS10 wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 00:27Edited since i found the time to add a source
In an interview with sky Horner quite literally said that the car was built around Max' driving style:
With regards to the drivers' involvement in development:Both in qualifying and in the race, the Mexican is clearly number two in the team. How does Horner explain that?
He refers to the special characteristics of the current RB16B and says that the car "certainly developed around Max' driving style", as the team boss puts it.He also said that Max likes a nervous car on corner entry.But by 2022, Perez will find it easier, says Horner. Formula 1 would then open a whole new chapter and technically start "from scratch". [...] In fact, Red Bull Perez has already been involved in "preparatory work" for 2022, says Horner. "That will of course intensify in the second half of the year. Checo will play a very active role there."..."This car is very nervous at the corner entry, as Max likes it," Red Bull team boss Horner said.
Those quotes are all from sky, that was after they confirmed Perez but before the Belgian GP when Horner explained why they kept him and why he was struggling.
So going by Horner's very own words it wouldn't really be a myth, both that a car will inevitably end up suiting a driver if he's with the team for long enough and that some drivers prefer a (obviously still balanced) but oversteery/nervous car on entry.
Verstappen, like Hamilton, Alonso, Schumacher, Senna.... is an exceptional driver that can adapt to anything. I don't believe for a second Verstappen wants a nervous frontend. Go watch one of the documentaries about his career and he will literally explain he wants a balanced car that is predictable, just like every other driver.
I think if you look at the past and the cars where Adrian Newey have been involved, they always where a little edgy. Maybe because of his talent to make it aerodynamically efficient? I am guessing here, but you could definitely see it in the mclaren back then.
To me this just sounds like Christian Horner is using the talent (adaptability) of Verstappen to draw the attention away of the weakness (relative) of their car to make Perez look a little better while also taking into account the cars of next year are so different from the current cars, the gap might just be a little less big between the two (which I don't expect personally).
Yes. Even in sim racing, sometimes I try setups from guys that are really fast, also known as aliens and I find them undriveable. I'm sure this happens in the real world as well. From what I've read Verstappen is a guy that likes to rotate the car early on entry, keep the car flat through the corner, he puts relatively little lock on the wheel and turns the car mostly with the throttle. A driver like that probably needs a pointy front end and a loose rear which he can control. Most drivers will find that balance hard to deal with.darkpino wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 22:31Again: having a balanced car really comes down to driving style suited to the setup/car. Someone who trailbrakes more will have a harder time in a car which is more prone to oversteer for example. Where someone who trailbrakes less will find it perfectly balanced or maybe even understeering.Gillian wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 19:43I don't think it would take a lot of effort to find more things said by Christian Horner that are not true or atleast not the entire truth.RZS10 wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 00:27Edited since i found the time to add a source
In an interview with sky Horner quite literally said that the car was built around Max' driving style:
With regards to the drivers' involvement in development:
He also said that Max likes a nervous car on corner entry.
...
Those quotes are all from sky, that was after they confirmed Perez but before the Belgian GP when Horner explained why they kept him and why he was struggling.
So going by Horner's very own words it wouldn't really be a myth, both that a car will inevitably end up suiting a driver if he's with the team for long enough and that some drivers prefer a (obviously still balanced) but oversteery/nervous car on entry.
Verstappen, like Hamilton, Alonso, Schumacher, Senna.... is an exceptional driver that can adapt to anything. I don't believe for a second Verstappen wants a nervous frontend. Go watch one of the documentaries about his career and he will literally explain he wants a balanced car that is predictable, just like every other driver.
I think if you look at the past and the cars where Adrian Newey have been involved, they always where a little edgy. Maybe because of his talent to make it aerodynamically efficient? I am guessing here, but you could definitely see it in the mclaren back then.
To me this just sounds like Christian Horner is using the talent (adaptability) of Verstappen to draw the attention away of the weakness (relative) of their car to make Perez look a little better while also taking into account the cars of next year are so different from the current cars, the gap might just be a little less big between the two (which I don't expect personally).
A good driver indeed can adapt to changing situations but that doesn’t make it strange that right now Perez is like the third driver (fourth if you count Ricciardo also) who fails next to Verstappen
See my response above. I think we are saying roughly the same thing. I hope the distinction I made above between design and setup makes sense.darkpino wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 22:31Again: having a balanced car really comes down to driving style suited to the setup/car. Someone who trailbrakes more will have a harder time in a car which is more prone to oversteer for example. Where someone who trailbrakes less will find it perfectly balanced or maybe even understeering.Gillian wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 19:43I don't think it would take a lot of effort to find more things said by Christian Horner that are not true or atleast not the entire truth.RZS10 wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 00:27Edited since i found the time to add a source
In an interview with sky Horner quite literally said that the car was built around Max' driving style:
With regards to the drivers' involvement in development:
He also said that Max likes a nervous car on corner entry.
...
Those quotes are all from sky, that was after they confirmed Perez but before the Belgian GP when Horner explained why they kept him and why he was struggling.
So going by Horner's very own words it wouldn't really be a myth, both that a car will inevitably end up suiting a driver if he's with the team for long enough and that some drivers prefer a (obviously still balanced) but oversteery/nervous car on entry.
Verstappen, like Hamilton, Alonso, Schumacher, Senna.... is an exceptional driver that can adapt to anything. I don't believe for a second Verstappen wants a nervous frontend. Go watch one of the documentaries about his career and he will literally explain he wants a balanced car that is predictable, just like every other driver.
I think if you look at the past and the cars where Adrian Newey have been involved, they always where a little edgy. Maybe because of his talent to make it aerodynamically efficient? I am guessing here, but you could definitely see it in the mclaren back then.
To me this just sounds like Christian Horner is using the talent (adaptability) of Verstappen to draw the attention away of the weakness (relative) of their car to make Perez look a little better while also taking into account the cars of next year are so different from the current cars, the gap might just be a little less big between the two (which I don't expect personally).
A good driver indeed can adapt to changing situations but that doesn’t make it strange that right now Perez is like the third driver (fourth if you count Ricciardo also) who fails next to Verstappen
Posting here in Red Bull team thread as it's the Red Bull that has filed the complaint and Ferrari has the same concerns.Ferrari sees double standard over Mercedes F1 engine saga
Binotto said that Ferrari had not lodged any of its own questions with the FIA regarding the Mercedes system, but confirmed he had spoken to Red Bull boss Christian Horner over the matter.
Asked if Ferrari was involved in any FIA action, Binotto said: “No, we didn't, even though like all teams and all manufacturers, we try to understand what our rivals are doing; we analyse the images and look at the GPS data.
“We had some doubts and we discussed them with Red Bull. I personally spoke to Christian Horner, but we did not submit any clarification questions to the FIA.”
Those clarifications are usually the more political way of trying to find out if a competitor is doing something new or in a grey area (or outright illegal of course). It’s asking the FIA if a certain design (on their own car) will be allowed. So, it’s not a complaint against Mercedes officially, but between the lines it is… these clarifications happen a lot and a lot of times it’s guesswork.
There's no way that Red Bull are doing anything to benefit the other teams. Anything they do will be intended entirely for their own benefit.godlameroso wrote: ↑09 Sep 2021, 12:51I think it's important to note that teams banding together politically will keep Mercedes from having too much influence. The question is, would the teams have done this if Mercedes had not been as aggressive in it's political moves. Credit to RBR for taking advantage of the situation and adapting to it for not just their own benefit, but for other teams as well.