Max won against a faster Mercedes car by performing better and making less mistake.
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Red Bull performed better than Mercedes and helped max win way more points than you think though.
Adrian Newey said his car was faster than the Mercedes, so can we stop these low key troll posts now? Why can't you be proud that the team did a good job! Max is just one person in the team, he did his job with what he was given, but the team deserves credit too. This is the team thread after all.
Of course Newey would say that. The stats say different however, unless you are you the believe the word of every designer on the grid.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:36Adrian Newey said his car was faster than the Mercedes, so can we stop these low key troll posts now? Why can't you be proud that the team did a good job! Max is just one person in the team, he did his job with what he was given, but the team deserves credit too. This is the team thread after all.
"faster also doesn't mean better package for taking points. You need a car that works well"AeroDynamic wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 16:57Red Bull performed better than Mercedes and helped max win way more points than you think though.
faster also doesn't mean better package for taking points. You need a car that works well. Same with the engine. he had the advantage there throughout the season.
So you deny Newey the technical director who is known for his honesty then you deny the poles, wins, fastest laps and corner speeds? We need to stop this now.Dee wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:40Of course Newey would say that. The stats say different however, unless you are you the believe the word of every designer on the grid.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:36Adrian Newey said his car was faster than the Mercedes, so can we stop these low key troll posts now? Why can't you be proud that the team did a good job! Max is just one person in the team, he did his job with what he was given, but the team deserves credit too. This is the team thread after all.
The absolute hypocrisy of you asking to stop troll posts after what you have just written
There is nothing wrong with winning with the fastest car. There is something wrong with a blanket statement of RB having the fastest car all season when that is entirely wrong.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:55So you deny Newey the technical director who is known for his honesty then you deny the poles, wins, fastest laps and corner speeds? We need to stop this now.Dee wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:40Of course Newey would say that. The stats say different however, unless you are you the believe the word of every designer on the grid.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:36
Adrian Newey said his car was faster than the Mercedes, so can we stop these low key troll posts now? Why can't you be proud that the team did a good job! Max is just one person in the team, he did his job with what he was given, but the team deserves credit too. This is the team thread after all.
The absolute hypocrisy of you asking to stop troll posts after what you have just written
Max did an awesome job and deserves the championship. What is wrong if he had the fastest car over he season? Does that diminish his driving ability? I think not. Even the most ardent detractor would have to a fool not to rate Max as a top driver. Look at Michael Schumacher, Aryton Senna, they had the fastest cars and no one can deny their driving greatness.
Let's stop this faster car, slower car foolishness as veiled way to pump up, or diminish drivers.
Dee wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 18:15.jz11 wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 18:04.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:55So you deny Newey the technical director who is known for his honesty then you deny the poles, wins, fastest laps and corner speeds? We need to stop this now.
Max did an awesome job and deserves the championship. What is wrong if he had the fastest car over he season? Does that diminish his driving ability? I think not. Even the most ardent detractor would have to a fool not to rate Max as a top driver. Look at Michael Schumacher, Aryton Senna, they had the fastest cars and no one can deny their driving greatness.
Let's stop this faster car, slower car foolishness as veiled way to pump up, or diminish drivers.
and how any of this has to do with anything in 2022, two thousand and twenty TWO?!
there is nothing left of that dead horse you're still beating, just a memory.
There is nothing wrong with winning with the fastest car. There is something wrong with a blanket statement
of RB having the fastest car all season when that is entirely wrong.
Max vs Lewis may have been very close, but their cars...
The Red Bull - Honda was obviously not the fastest car in the final four races, which is why Verstappen had to both drive and race it so hard, obviously on or over the limit (e.g., hitting the wall in Saudi Arabia). Over the season it was certainly a fast car, and it was a shame that drivers' points were lost through incidents when the RBR-Honda was the fastest car.PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:55So you deny Newey the technical director who is known for his honesty then you deny the poles, wins, fastest laps and corner speeds? We need to stop this now.
I dunno, unfortunately Red Bull signed Perez instead of Alonso, so we will never know.
No, I don’t have a definitive opinion on which car was faster. But I do agree Red Bull trackside team were better than Mercedes across the season. They performed better on track strategy calls and they were much more effective at getting decisions their way with Masi via Jonathan Wheatley.Dee wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:43"faster also doesn't mean better package for taking points. You need a car that works well"AeroDynamic wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 16:57Red Bull performed better than Mercedes and helped max win way more points than you think though.
faster also doesn't mean better package for taking points. You need a car that works well. Same with the engine. he had the advantage there throughout the season.
So you agree that Red Bull statistically did not have the better car over the year and driver performance and team strategy was the difference?
"But I do agree Red Bull trackside team were better than Mercedes across the season"AeroDynamic wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 18:33No, I don’t have a definitive opinion on which car was faster. But I do agree Red Bull trackside team were better than Mercedes across the season. They performed better on track strategy calls and they were much more effective at getting decisions their way with Masi via Jonathan Wheatley.Dee wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 17:43"faster also doesn't mean better package for taking points. You need a car that works well"AeroDynamic wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 16:57
Red Bull performed better than Mercedes and helped max win way more points than you think though.
faster also doesn't mean better package for taking points. You need a car that works well. Same with the engine. he had the advantage there throughout the season.
So you agree that Red Bull statistically did not have the better car over the year and driver performance and team strategy was the difference?
I definitively think the Red Bull was the better car in almost all metrics outside of ceiling of speed potential.
I think the Mercedes had bigger potential of pace at certain phases of the season but proved cumbersome to utilise that pace. Mostly because of the change of regulations to the floor hurt the car concept significantly more than Red Bulls. The set up window was bigger and much easier time to work the car for each circuit which proved a pivotal aspect in a season where practice sessions were shorter, and the rival team had a difficult car to unlock performance from. The engine was solid from Honda all season and did not incur penalty in performance or grid for replacement parts. They had one weekend to change engine but the stars aligned and gave them an easy opportunity to bag p2 instead of p7 as an example. The RB18 was less sensitive to conditions when unlocking performance as well.
The races where Mercedes could have maximised points were thrown off by a number of variables going against it. Smaller nuanced forms of luck went to RBR in the second half of the season.
So let's stop this wild propaganda now please.Longtime chief designer Newey reckons Red Bull on balance had a quicker car during the course of the 2021 F1 season but agrees that Mercedes managed to claw back a lot towards the end of the year where they were quite handy.
He agrees that regulation changes suited Red Bull more than Mercedes, but they all agreed to it. “It’s difficult to know exactly I mean we all voted for the regulation changes,” said Newey. “Did it suit us more than Mercedes? It seems so certainly earlier in the year, obviously the last few races they’ve come back very strong.
“I think on balance we’ve probably had the quicker car and that’s a tribute to everybody back in the factory really. I think obviously everybody’s. We’re all in the limelight here but what the guys have done back in the factory my colleague engineers the everybody everybody in the whole place the support we feel when we’re out here that they give us is amazing,” summed up Newey.
You misunderstand. Vettel's first shot at winning a wdc was in 2010.JordanMugen wrote: ↑05 Mar 2022, 15:39I don't see how, Vettel had a car capable of winning regularly seven times ('09,10,11,12,13,17,18) and has four titles to show for it, so less than the 100% rate of Verstappen.
Vettel took four wins in '09, but Webber took two other wins in the RBR, so in theory Vettel could have matched the six wins that driver's title winner Button scored and negated or overhauled Button's 9pt WDC margin.
IIRC Vettel had unnecessary crashes in Australia and Malaysia, so that too (plus Webber outperforming Vettel in some races), could have cost RBR the WDC despite having a regular race winning car.