Agreed but they will still be 50-70hp down on the other engines ,and more importantly, can they recover energy at 350kw at all? Newey claimed in Australia they couldn’t even hit 250kw, so have they solved that issue? If the issue is the ICE is down 50 plus horsepower AND the recovery is also lacking 100kw then this performance deficit isn’t getting better anytime soon with Honda. Running an extra 1000rpm, so the engine makes all 515hp, doesn’t help after 1 lap when that same engine cannot recoup enough energy to power the 400kw electric motor. According to sources the Honda engine is horrible at charging up the battery pack and lacks even more power while doing that.The ADOU to fix these various issues seems unlikely this season, and sounds like a complete redesign is needed.
I'm actually growing tired of this "Aston don't know how good their chassis is because the engine is THAT bad". Seriously? It's down 50hp, not 500hp. It's achieving similar speeds as the others, they aren't 50kph down. They have plenty of information to understand how rubbish or not the chassis is. It's such an insane fallacy to continually imply they have zero idea how good the chassis is and it is solely Honda's fault. Can we please get a grip and come back down to reality.V10FURY wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 00:18Agreed but they will still be 50-70hp down on the other engines ,and more importantly, can they recover energy at 350kw at all? Newey claimed in Australia they couldn’t even hit 250kw, so have they solved that issue? If the issue is the ICE is down 50 plus horsepower AND the recovery is also lacking 100kw then this performance deficit isn’t getting better anytime soon with Honda. Running an extra 1000rpm, so the engine makes all 515hp, doesn’t help after 1 lap when that same engine cannot recoup enough energy to power the 400kw electric motor. According to sources the Honda engine is horrible at charging up the battery pack and lacks even more power while doing that.The ADOU to fix these various issues seems unlikely this season, and sounds like a complete redesign is needed.
How can Aston even tell how good or bad their chassis is without being able to run the engine at full power for any length of time to test it? I think Miami should be considered the final preseason test for Aston, and then we will see if the rest of this season is a write off, or they might at least catch Cadillac and Williams. It seems ridiculous that Cadillac is doing a better job, and they are faster than Aston on track. But unless the team can get reliability / vibrations under control there is no chance of any progress. I hope they can show a significant improvement in those areas in Miami so they can then start to focus on improving performance after Monaco. Two DNFs and 3 + seconds off the pace in Miami is likely still what the team is facing. Being competitive in 2027 is already looking unlikely at this point without seeing some trending uptick in lap times and reliability. Fingers crossed.![]()
Yes please!
The weekend is almost here. What's the point in arguing about it, soon we'll have stop watch confirmation.Brahmal wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 02:52Yes please!![]()
The quotes from Mr. Orihara are most likely an exercise in expectation management. This is a time for Honda to underpromise and overdeliver. The alternative means PU is fundamentally flawed and everyone was always screwed, so no sense in worrying about it.
Yes, Aston's chassis is clearly weak and car is overweight. They were probably 2 months behind everyone anyway. But they have had maybe 10% of mileage in testing of most other teams largely due to engine reliability. And most of that running being done at compromised speeds. You cannot improve the aero of the car because the first piority of the team has become to adapt the car to not vibrate itself to pieces.GhostF1 wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 01:06I'm actually growing tired of this "Aston don't know how good their chassis is because the engine is THAT bad". Seriously? It's down 50hp, not 500hp. It's achieving similar speeds as the others, they aren't 50kph down. They have plenty of information to understand how rubbish or not the chassis is. It's such an insane fallacy to continually imply they have zero idea how good the chassis is and it is solely Honda's fault. Can we please get a grip and come back down to reality.V10FURY wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 00:18Agreed but they will still be 50-70hp down on the other engines ,and more importantly, can they recover energy at 350kw at all? Newey claimed in Australia they couldn’t even hit 250kw, so have they solved that issue? If the issue is the ICE is down 50 plus horsepower AND the recovery is also lacking 100kw then this performance deficit isn’t getting better anytime soon with Honda. Running an extra 1000rpm, so the engine makes all 515hp, doesn’t help after 1 lap when that same engine cannot recoup enough energy to power the 400kw electric motor. According to sources the Honda engine is horrible at charging up the battery pack and lacks even more power while doing that.The ADOU to fix these various issues seems unlikely this season, and sounds like a complete redesign is needed.
How can Aston even tell how good or bad their chassis is without being able to run the engine at full power for any length of time to test it? I think Miami should be considered the final preseason test for Aston, and then we will see if the rest of this season is a write off, or they might at least catch Cadillac and Williams. It seems ridiculous that Cadillac is doing a better job, and they are faster than Aston on track. But unless the team can get reliability / vibrations under control there is no chance of any progress. I hope they can show a significant improvement in those areas in Miami so they can then start to focus on improving performance after Monaco. Two DNFs and 3 + seconds off the pace in Miami is likely still what the team is facing. Being competitive in 2027 is already looking unlikely at this point without seeing some trending uptick in lap times and reliability. Fingers crossed.![]()
They've had battery issues, the vibration issue is not solely on Honda, that much has got to be obvious, the ICE has actually been rock solid reliability wise. The gearbox is a KNOWN weak point that is a limitation in everything required for correct functioning in this formula here. There are a lot of moving parts here. Let's actually have an intelligent conversation here.
i keep hearing about this gearbox problem from people that dont really know anything. if youd like to seperate yourself from those guys please send a link. usually those individuals are naming anything that points away from the PU though. the first step is always admitting that you have a problemGhostF1 wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 01:06I'm actually growing tired of this "Aston don't know how good their chassis is because the engine is THAT bad". Seriously? It's down 50hp, not 500hp. It's achieving similar speeds as the others, they aren't 50kph down. They have plenty of information to understand how rubbish or not the chassis is. It's such an insane fallacy to continually imply they have zero idea how good the chassis is and it is solely Honda's fault. Can we please get a grip and come back down to reality.V10FURY wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 00:18Agreed but they will still be 50-70hp down on the other engines ,and more importantly, can they recover energy at 350kw at all? Newey claimed in Australia they couldn’t even hit 250kw, so have they solved that issue? If the issue is the ICE is down 50 plus horsepower AND the recovery is also lacking 100kw then this performance deficit isn’t getting better anytime soon with Honda. Running an extra 1000rpm, so the engine makes all 515hp, doesn’t help after 1 lap when that same engine cannot recoup enough energy to power the 400kw electric motor. According to sources the Honda engine is horrible at charging up the battery pack and lacks even more power while doing that.The ADOU to fix these various issues seems unlikely this season, and sounds like a complete redesign is needed.
How can Aston even tell how good or bad their chassis is without being able to run the engine at full power for any length of time to test it? I think Miami should be considered the final preseason test for Aston, and then we will see if the rest of this season is a write off, or they might at least catch Cadillac and Williams. It seems ridiculous that Cadillac is doing a better job, and they are faster than Aston on track. But unless the team can get reliability / vibrations under control there is no chance of any progress. I hope they can show a significant improvement in those areas in Miami so they can then start to focus on improving performance after Monaco. Two DNFs and 3 + seconds off the pace in Miami is likely still what the team is facing. Being competitive in 2027 is already looking unlikely at this point without seeing some trending uptick in lap times and reliability. Fingers crossed.![]()
They've had battery issues, the vibration issue is not solely on Honda, that much has got to be obvious, the ICE has actually been rock solid reliability wise. The gearbox is a KNOWN weak point that is a limitation in everything required for correct functioning in this formula here. There are a lot of moving parts here. Let's actually have an intelligent conversation here.
Badger wrote: ↑28 Apr 2026, 12:10That is quite an astonishing quote for the rest of the season if you are AMR.
We have made some progress, which will allow us to implement new corrective measures in Miami and later in the season"
Being realistic, this progress WILL NOT have a visible impact on the power unit's on-track performance, so we MUST NOT expect major advances here"
collindsilva wrote: ↑28 Apr 2026, 06:39For Miami,
New Honda engine - is this new spec engine or upgraded engine, if new spec, then this should be the benchmark for ADOU. if it is upgraded, then Is it ADOU upgrade.
New steering column - so the vibration from the engine is not yet resolved.
Its confusing...
Based on what? The perfromance is dreadful. The can only make a "new one" for 2027 only with ADUO to begin with...Jambier wrote: ↑28 Apr 2026, 12:44To summarize:
- they have done some full testing
- they are starting to implement fixes
Goal is to finish the races, remove vibrations, improve drivability
So 0 performance upgrade.
Also I’m keeping the same opinion that Honda will not be able to use ADUO, they will do a new one for 2027 and that’s it
autosport wrote:there is still considerable room for improvement on the software side, where the parameters allow more freedom of action. However, it should be remembered that from a certain point in the season onward, software updates will also be limited, so each intervention will need to be planned more carefully.
The issue is the baseless, braindead parroting that the chassis can't be tested because the engine is so flawed and that it's the only reason the car is performing where it is, if we had a MErc PU we'd be top of the midfield. No, we wouldn't. No one is saying Honda shouldn't cop some of the blame here, they clearly do need to have some accountability for the PU's ultimate performance, and yes 50hp is a substantial deficiency on a total performance level when compared to other teams, however it is not a development inhibiting amount.. like please. I'm not discussing top speeds as a measure of power unit performance. I'm mentioning race speeds as being within the ballpark as that it isn't a preventative to understanding the base characteristics of the chassis, and claiming as such is nonsensical.peewon wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 03:47Yes, Aston's chassis is clearly weak and car is overweight. They were probably 2 months behind everyone anyway. But they have had maybe 10% of mileage in testing of most other teams largely due to engine reliability. And most of that running being done at compromised speeds. You cannot improve the aero of the car because the first piority of the team has become to adapt the car to not vibrate itself to pieces.GhostF1 wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 01:06I'm actually growing tired of this "Aston don't know how good their chassis is because the engine is THAT bad". Seriously? It's down 50hp, not 500hp. It's achieving similar speeds as the others, they aren't 50kph down. They have plenty of information to understand how rubbish or not the chassis is. It's such an insane fallacy to continually imply they have zero idea how good the chassis is and it is solely Honda's fault. Can we please get a grip and come back down to reality.V10FURY wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 00:18
Agreed but they will still be 50-70hp down on the other engines ,and more importantly, can they recover energy at 350kw at all? Newey claimed in Australia they couldn’t even hit 250kw, so have they solved that issue? If the issue is the ICE is down 50 plus horsepower AND the recovery is also lacking 100kw then this performance deficit isn’t getting better anytime soon with Honda. Running an extra 1000rpm, so the engine makes all 515hp, doesn’t help after 1 lap when that same engine cannot recoup enough energy to power the 400kw electric motor. According to sources the Honda engine is horrible at charging up the battery pack and lacks even more power while doing that.The ADOU to fix these various issues seems unlikely this season, and sounds like a complete redesign is needed.
How can Aston even tell how good or bad their chassis is without being able to run the engine at full power for any length of time to test it? I think Miami should be considered the final preseason test for Aston, and then we will see if the rest of this season is a write off, or they might at least catch Cadillac and Williams. It seems ridiculous that Cadillac is doing a better job, and they are faster than Aston on track. But unless the team can get reliability / vibrations under control there is no chance of any progress. I hope they can show a significant improvement in those areas in Miami so they can then start to focus on improving performance after Monaco. Two DNFs and 3 + seconds off the pace in Miami is likely still what the team is facing. Being competitive in 2027 is already looking unlikely at this point without seeing some trending uptick in lap times and reliability. Fingers crossed.![]()
They've had battery issues, the vibration issue is not solely on Honda, that much has got to be obvious, the ICE has actually been rock solid reliability wise. The gearbox is a KNOWN weak point that is a limitation in everything required for correct functioning in this formula here. There are a lot of moving parts here. Let's actually have an intelligent conversation here.
50 Hp down is an extraordinary deficit. Literally makes you uncompetitive. Based on historical data, that translates to 0.6 - 1.0 second per lap deficit. According to some estimates, the deficit is closer to 60-70KW.
Acheiving similar speeds? What top speeds? If thats what you are refering to, thats the dumbest way to judge how the PU is performing.
Honda has had vibration issues with Mclaren, Red Bull and now Aston Martin. They probably share some blame here but the pattern is hard to ignore.
The gearbox maybe a problem but Ive yet to see anything that says its THE PROBLEM holding everything back. Like where is this theory coming from?
Yes, Aston is lagging on the aero side which makes sense how far behind they were and they probably made some mistakes as well or were too ambitious. But these things cannot be improved without proper running and not having a functional PU seriously inhibits that.
Huh? It's extremely evident they are the furthest behind. I'm not sure anyone in their right mind would disagree with that evaluation. But there is a difference between being the lowest performing PU (see Renault PU the last 4 years) and also being the "only reason" for a teams poor performance and mishaps. That is a distinction that is getting lost and yet it's one of the most important things for any of us to maybe comprehend here. You could put a Merc in the back of this car and we'd still be challenging a Haas. That is still unacceptable for the size and capability Aston has at the moment.peewon wrote: ↑29 Apr 2026, 23:19https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/f1-c ... xtra-help/
While some fans and certain media outlets continue to make excuses for Honda and downplay how bad their PU is, rival manufactures and FIA are thinking about changing the rules to help Honda even more than what is already allowed under ADUO. This should make it very clear where they stand when they are not even seen as a threat in the future by their competitors.